Sunday, August 01, 2010

The build up to the Drew Mitchell red card

The build up to the Drew Mitchell red card

Theres been a bit of confusion about the first yellow card issued to Drew Mitchell in the Wallabies 49-28 loss to the All Blacks this weekend. As discussed on the RD Facebook page earlier today, the reason for this is that a replay of the tackle was not shown on certain broadcasts. In this clip though you can see the tackle, as well as the lead up to the rare red card for a professional foul.

The Wallabies were down 32-14 then had to play the majority of the second half with just 14 men after Mitchell was given a second yellow card, resulting in a red, for preventing a quick lineout throw in from taking place.

He was initially sin binned for a late, no arms tackle on All Blacks captain Richie McCaw. It was spotted by both the tough judge and referee Craig Joubert, but play continued until the ball went dead, which is what led to things not being completely clear at first.

While he was off the park, both Australia and New Zealand infringed by preventing one another from taking quick taps from penalties. Joubert eventually chatted to the captains and gave them a general warning. Mitchell then returned two minutes into the second half, and paid the price for being the next player to infringe.

"Unfortunately the referee had given a general warning... but for a test match, it seemed a bit sort of out of kilter that you've lost one man because a player throws a ball away," said unhappy Australian rugby boss John O'Neill. "It's not as though he punched someone or it's a dangerous tackle. But you've got to live with it."

While ONeill, and of course many others, have criticised not only the Mitchell decisions, but the Owen Franks yellow for a shoulder charge as well, All Blacks coach Graham Henry accepted the firm stance.

"The referee's pretty tough but I think that's important you get a decent game of footy," he said. "If he is grey on the tackle area or grey on people throwing the ball away when the other side wants it then you've got a shambles on your hands.

"It's good that he's strict and he sticks to what he says he's got to do. You'd prefer a referee who's tough even if he goes over the top occasionally. That's better than someone who sits on the fence and doesn't rule," said Henry.

Mitchell was cited but cleared after the punishment he received was deemed sufficient.

If you're a Facebook user and haven't already 'liked' Rugbydump, do so now to make sure you get the latest updates from not only this website, but other interesting clips, news stories, and more. The big discussion for now is, was this red card harsh, or is everyone happy as long as the referees are consistent?


Time: 03:57

Posted at 10:40 pm | 98 comments

Viewing 98 comments

filipe August 01, 2010 9:43 pm

This was the first time I ever saw a referee calling the captains by their names. Is it normal? great refereeing though

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Maximus August 01, 2010 9:45 pm

"It's good that he's strict and he sticks to what he says he's got to do. You'd prefer a referee who's tough even if he goes over the top occasionally. That's better than someone who sits on the fence and doesn't rule," said Henry.

Totally agree. Please, let's not turn into soccer: shouting at the ref's decisions, moaning and diving to gain penalties and blatantly preventing the other team from playing quickly. All things that make a soccer match painful to watch.
So, totally agree.

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Jimbo August 01, 2010 9:51 pm

Firstly, great competition, good running rugby on both sides. Completely agree with both sendings off from shoulder charges but does anyone else think McCaw milks the charge a little and dives?

Great refing sending him off a second time. Sends a clear message to the players that he will do what he says he will do.

Quote of the game "Rocky, don't shout at me"

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Alain August 01, 2010 9:52 pm

I hope alain rolland was watching.. this is our you ment to ref a rugby match,, no grey area what so ever.

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ben.w.thomas18 August 01, 2010 9:55 pm

Totally fair refereeing, stuck to what he said about the infringements and yellow carded the next player to infringe on the rules, just happened to be Mitchell when he returned to play. Like Henry said,

"You'd prefer a referee who's tough even if he goes over the top occasionally. That's better than someone who sits on the fence and doesn't rule"

I know i would rather have a ref who lays out the boundaries and then sticks to what he says then the complete opposite, makes for a much better game of rugby

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Flooz August 01, 2010 9:57 pm

Seems like the referre just did what he had to do. He effectively give few preventions before. it's very bad luck for mitchell.

But is there anybody who believe that NZ are a bit protected in this Tri-nations? Is it because of the RWC 2011 approaching?

and a last point, more i look mac caw, more i have the impression that he just acts as a soccer player: cheating, milking, diving like a great didier drogba. He's a great leader but what a poor spirit from a rugby player. sad and disappointing to watch him

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Benson August 01, 2010 10:02 pm

I totally disagree Flooz, and with other comments about McCaw. Yes he pushes the line at the break down and I think he should get yellow carded much more than he usually does, but I don't think he milked that. He was knocked off his feet, late, and it wasn't a proper tackle. To call that a dive is against the laws of physics surely. Watch his feet.

'Rocky, Richie..' Certainly two guys I wouldnt want to have to stand inbetween and reprimand. :)

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Andy August 01, 2010 10:02 pm

This was a fantastic display off refereeing. Strict, but clear and consistent, which allowed an awesome flowing game. No team/captain could 'play' him - Joubert was in complete control.

This is what happens when a ref that has super 14 experience (the only one so far in the tri-nations) takes control of a big SH game.

Well done Criag Joubert - you are the benchmark!

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Chris Boy August 01, 2010 10:03 pm

i don't think the tackle should have been a card. that happens about 10 times a match, someone passes off and the tackler ends up continuing his run into the guy who's just offloaded.

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Benson August 01, 2010 10:05 pm

To add to what I said, yes he did stick his arm in the air slightly, but firstly, it may not have been in a 'diving/milking' manner, and secondly, even if it was, he's entitled to - it was a late hit! He could have been a real b*tch and held his face, rolled on the floor and shouted at the ref. Mitchell would still be the one who commited the late hit.

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jtjs2289 August 01, 2010 10:06 pm

I watched that entire game and didn't realise how often it happened, and not just that but the amount of times the ref picked up on it. In the end it is a penalty offence like hands in a ruck and if that was continuously being used by a team, then the referee would take the same action. Great refereeing! Great video compilation as well to prove the point!

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Bomber August 01, 2010 10:08 pm

Gotta love Richies dive.

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WelshOsprey August 01, 2010 10:13 pm

I thought the ref had a good game, no nonsense and not afraid to give the cards.
I also bet this video gets LOADS of comments.

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Falafel August 01, 2010 10:56 pm

I mentioned this in the other video, but perhaps this is a better place to bring it up.

Any thoughts on the 2 yellows = 1 red policy in rugby?

Is there any reason why it should maybe be a red only if it's a particularly hideous foul or for consistent infringement of the same kind? Whereas for two yellow-card penalties of different kinds, you could just make the player serve a second 10 minutes in the bin (not a full ejection).

Anyways, I thought Joubert was fully right to card Mitchell for slapping the ball down to prevent the quick throw. Such a childish thing for a rugby player to do.

Thanks for the video, RD - I never saw what Mitchell's first yellow was for (from the look of the replay, it was pretty undeserved - as was Franks).

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VictorSoCalRuggger August 01, 2010 11:00 pm

AnY OnE eLsE FiNd It IrOnIc, that the previous 3 trinations games ppl werent too happy with the outcomes let alone the ref, all of a sudden we have a southern hemisphere ref, and ppl are actually applauding him, even when giving a red card...

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granite August 01, 2010 11:15 pm

Thanks for posting this RD. I was at the game and we all had NO IDEA wtf was going on. They have a habit of not replaying penalties and quite often the penalties they flash up on the screen are wrong.
We could only guess why Drew was sent off the first time (TBH, looks like McCaw took a dive), and all the times the ref marched a team 10metres we could only guess because it was back-chat. Had we known that each time it was for knocking the ball away, we would have understood why Drew was sent.

Try to imagine how confused we all were after what we saw:
1. Drew gets a yellow for something nobody in the crowd saw.
2. Drew gets another yellow, for doing something that happens many times every game without punishment
3. We're down a player for the last 30 min. WTF?

But again, thanks for posting this RD, it (unfortunately) makes it more understandable.

Still sad we lost :(

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Les Bleus August 01, 2010 11:56 pm

Did anyone see the dump tackle Sam Whitelock did, and the ref wanted to yellow him but he wasn't sure who did it and gave a penalty, was as legal as anything. I agree with the first shoulder charge by the All Blacks but Drews first yellow card is a huge, what the hell moment.

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Jeff August 02, 2010 12:02 am

Great refereeing. Richie talked to his team and Rocky didn't - that's the difference.

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Cameron August 02, 2010 12:15 am

I can't believe people are calling this fantastic refereeing!

Drew Mitchell was obviously pulling out of the tackle, he had his hands up to push-off McCaw, who threw a dive of Italian-soccer-team proportions. He's thrown his hands up in the air in a plead to the referee before any contact is even made!

As for the second yellow card, we see at the start of the video the AB's constantly knocking the ball out of the Wallaby player's hands, and Rocky even having a word to the referee about it, with no consequence, not even a penalty. When it happens the other way around it results in a second yellow, red card and gifts the much the ABs.

I realise the call went both ways, but those two yellows were game-changing and neither of them were really warranted.

I think the ABs would have won anyway, and they are the better team. But only an ardent All Black supporter would call this consistent and fair refereeing.

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RyDR August 02, 2010 12:30 am

Absolutly top notch refereeing! Very good to see after some shockers this season. Saying that I don't like where Rugby is heading. I would love to see refs allowing the game to flow (like this game was). The scores from both sides were massive and the game was player at a frantic pace.

The first was milked by Richie, say what you will about the man but he knows how to play the game and the officials and will go down in history as one of the best.

The two best running rugby sides in the world put on one hell of a show!

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slippery pete August 02, 2010 12:35 am

"But only an ardent All Black supporter would call this consistent and fair refereeing."

...or just anyone who appreciates consistency (I, for one, root against the AB's almost every game, but thought Joubert did well).

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slippery pete August 02, 2010 12:39 am

Les Bleus, Whitelock's tackle was (after seeing the replay) perfectly legal. If it had been a "tip tackle", I would've been partially disappointed if he wasn't suspended (but partially glad, since I think the other suspensions for JdV, Fourie, and Cooper have been total horseshit and I'd hate for that trend to continue).

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ElTigre August 02, 2010 1:29 am

lol at the angry australians.
Everybody else seems to think it was good reffing so why cant you guys?

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Alexander August 02, 2010 1:42 am

Anybody else think Franks was unlucky? Or was it indeed an illegal hit?

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Anonymous August 02, 2010 1:47 am

Yes i think it was fair that mitchel was sent, the ref had said that the next player who stoped quick ball would be carded and mitchel was just unlucky he had already got a yellow..
But the standard of reffing was dreadfull, he has no idea how to ref a scrum and as for the rucks he continued to let the all blacks come in off their feet and flop on the ball with out giving out any cards for slowing the ball down (which is wat mitchel was carded for).. and the amount of forward passes he missed was shocking.. I dont think he should be aloud to ref at a international level!

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secondfive August 02, 2010 2:05 am

Cameron said... "Drew Mitchell was obviously pulling out of the tackle, he had his hands up to push-off McCaw, who threw a dive of Italian-soccer-team proportions."

It was still late no matter what Mitchell did to try and disguise it, and McCaw went to ground as any other player would hit front-on without the ball. Your soccer comparison is a joke.

Cameron said..."we see at the start of the video the AB's constantly knocking the ball out of the Wallaby player's hands, and Rocky even having a word to the referee about it, with no consequence, not even a penalty."

Wrong.. the ref had just marched the ABs ten meters before Elsom started talking to him and the ref tells him so, and says he will be watching closely. The next time it's an Oz player who does it so the ref calls both captains together and gives them the warning. The video shows McCaw telling his team, maybe Elsom didn't.

Both sides were guilty early on before the ref cracked down.

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secondfive August 02, 2010 2:23 am

Flooz (is that you Peter de V?) said... But is there anybody who believe that NZ are a bit protected in this Tri-nations? Is it because of the RWC 2011 approaching?

I'm sure there are people who believe that but it's such a pointless and stupid idea that only an idiot would own up to it.
And in the same post you say the ref "did what he had to do", so how is that protecting NZ? Maybe the opposition are just getting bamboozled and frustrated by a better side.

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Opeta August 02, 2010 2:30 am

ELsom is a great player but hopeless communicator. You guys should have SHarpe as your captain. He is tough like Elsom, but is much better communicating, and rallying the troops. Rocky is a wrecking ball like Jerry Collins, and like Collins he is very much an individual lone wolf kinda guy, hard and brooding. You always want somone like that in your team - but not as captain! It affects other team mates negatively, and just plain pisses Refs off...

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Hi Ho August 02, 2010 2:44 am

I agree with Opeta, Rocky is not the right choice as Captain. He handled the role particularly poorly on Saturday.

Genia would be my first choice, then maybe Sharpe but he isn't a long term choice as he is closer to the end of his career than the start.

Pocock is another option but maybe a year or two too early for him.

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Jono August 02, 2010 2:50 am

Too many bloody yellows this tri-nations. I think that makes 10 yellows in four games!!
That's fucking ridiculous.
The refs have lost their tiny little godamn minds.
Though to be fair it's porbably the IRB fouling everything up again.
The main thing is that not every single ilegal tackle needs to result in a yellow, and the other main thing they should realise is that just because a tackle is big and spectacular and the tackler doesn'ty manage to maintain a hold of the tackled player, this DOES NOT mean it's automatically a shoulder charge.
Stop trying to cut everyone's nuts off for the sake of PC! Let them hit, stop unishsing good tackles with stupid, soft yellows.

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Yellow fever August 02, 2010 2:54 am

RYDR, how can you say top reffing, thens ay there's too many yellows? It's one or the other.
There's been too many yellows for sure.
They've cleaned up the ruck, which is great, but it seems like rugby union refs just cannot let themselves not be the focus of the game.
The beuty of the new law interpretatiosn is is takes the outcome of the game out of the refs hands and puts back into the hands of the players.
Sow hat do the refs do? Start hadning out cards like confetti, so they become the focus of everyone's attention again.

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Tommy August 02, 2010 2:59 am

Fuck me, that's the sofftest yellow card on Mitchell I have ever seen in my life.
Are you kidding?! He jsut gave him a little push! He wasn't even looking at mccaw and that isn't even a shoulder in the rules (how the fuck could it be a shoulder if he pushes him with his bloody hands?!)
Ridiculous, what the fuck are the refs playing at? What is happening to rugby, badminton is more of a contact sport now!

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Anonymous August 02, 2010 3:19 am

Already mentioned earlier, but this is really the difference between the teams -- McCaw spoke with the ABs, Elsom didn't. Say what you want about McCaw, but he's a true international captain who always makes the right decisions for his side. Not a Kiwi, but I tip my hat to him.

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Anonymous August 02, 2010 3:22 am

Alexander -- agreed about Franks, I thought that was a soft yellow too. Franks laid the wood on Brown, hit him so bloody hard he bounced back and thus no arms. Franks is a hard, physical player, exactly what you want in a tighthead, but nothing malicious about that hit, just good rugby. The incessant yellows have to stop.

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Jos GD August 02, 2010 4:07 am

Really funny, as filipe noticed (1st comment), referee calling captains "Rocky, Richie..."
BTW, good to see referees keeping authority like this, but totally disagree in punishing Mitchell for that very light contact with McCaw

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Anonymous August 02, 2010 4:09 am

The over reactions from the refs has already ruined this Tri-Nations.

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Anonymous August 02, 2010 4:22 am

On the All Blacks website, it says Cory Jane has played only 17 tests, when in fact he has played 18 tests. I wish this to be cleared up as soon as possible because it is misleading.

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Ned2or3 August 02, 2010 5:07 am

Both shouders were illegal (to the laws)- franks arms never came forward mitchells right hand was tucked in and down. Problem is the laws and not the referee

On whitelocks tip tackle- not a tip tackle didnt go past horizontal. Kudos to Barnes for staying inthe hit and not trying to roll out and make the tackle worse.

Kudos also to RD for showing me that I missed a few bits in the heat of the moment and also apologies to Joubert for all the bad names screamed at the TV.

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Baz August 02, 2010 5:30 am

This is an absolutely ridiculous display of refereeing. Too often, rugby referees are trying to be the centrepiece of the game.

I do recognise referees need to be firm, and consistent so we dont end up with a game turning into a riot, however why are they not making decisions in the spirit of the game? In my opinion, yes all these acts were illegal. but in all cases, a penalty would be sufficient.

In a massive match like the bledisloe cup, 3 points (presumed all these were just penalty offences) is a crucial advantage. Hoewever they do not dictate the outcome like a card does. So why are refs prepared to ruin a great spectactle.

I could go on for hours but i think the bottom line is that Rugby refs need to look at the individual situation. I know that i would not like to see something like the world cup winner decided by a referee.

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someone stop the kiw August 02, 2010 5:36 am

"Anonymous said...
The over reactions from the refs has already ruined this Tri-Nations."

While I think the overreactions from the officials (the citing commissions way more so than the referees, whose hands are usually forced by their higher-ups in the IRB) have been dreadful (so far, I think only Botha deserved to be suspended), I don't think it's ruined the 3N this year.

If anything, the AB's complete dominance has made the competition a bit boring for a neutral watching from outside those 3 countries.

But the Boks what-the-shit? poor performances (you realize how important a player like Fourie du Preez is when he's gone) and the Aussie's perseverance in the 2nd half (wonder if Mitchell had still been on the pitch if things would've turned out better for the Wallabies) have made for a few interesting bits of competition.

McCaw is definitely a top-notch captain, though. I wonder if Elsom spent too much time in Ireland and by some mysterious Gaelic magic, Paul O'Connell's style of bitching at referees rubbed off on him. ;)

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Cristian August 02, 2010 6:49 am

I think he jsut got sick of that ref's bullshit.
He slaughtered us in this game.
My kiwi mate at work came up this morning laughing and asked me what Australi ahd done to piss off the ref.
Beyond that this thing with the yellows is out of control.
Why are the refs such attention whores? Why can't they just let the teams play rugby without ruining it with their desperate need to impose themselves on the game.
This thing with thinking that every big tackle is a shoulder charge is also ridiculous.
Both yellows for shoulders in this game were beyond a joke.
Neither Franks tackle nor Mitchells little push (that wasn't even a fucking tackle, let alone a shoulder charge, Mitchell was looking in the other direction where the ball was going and ran into Mccaw by accident, he pushed him a bit with his hands, it was clearly an accident and clearly not dangerous, intentional, malicious or even faintly illegal).
Why do refs every season cause controversy and problems with the game with their stupid handling of matches?
JUST LET THEM PLAY RUGBY

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FrankyH August 02, 2010 6:50 am

"On the All Blacks website, it says Cory Jane has played only 17 tests, when in fact he has played 18 tests. I wish this to be cleared up as soon as possible because it is misleading."

I saw someone comment something like that once before. What gives? Tell them, not RD!

I agree that McCaw is excellent at handling the refs. He's always polite and off the field is a great guy. Rocky behaved like a spoilt brat and you can't have that in a captain. Sharpe would definitely be the right man for the job at this stage.

Regardless of the stern reffing - which btw I'm sure is coming directly from the IRB - it was a brilliant all blacks performance and Aus were dead and burried even before the red.

On Owen Franks, look at his right arm at the point of contact. It's facing straight down. You don't even need to over analyse it to see that he's smacked Brown with a league style hit. Fair call. Shouldn't be yellow though, just a penalty. Same then for Mitchell's hit.

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Disappointed August 02, 2010 7:03 am

I was at the game and the refereeing was atrocious in the last twenty - thirty minutes when the Wallabies were pound at the All Black line, three or four penaltys were given in a row for slowing down/ handling in the ruck yet no yellow card given. If he truly was being consistant at least another all black would have been sent to the sin bin.

Joubert took way too much control of the game and turned it into a spectacle, even the kiwi newspapers were disgusted with his officiating.

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Jono August 02, 2010 7:23 am

All I know, is that none of these yellow cards for shoulders would even be penalties under league rules. League has it right, union has it wrong on this one.
Union shoulder charge rules are incredibly soft (league types would be laughing at how soft) and also nonsensical, since every tackle involved hitting with the shoulder.

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zacaria August 02, 2010 7:48 am

even though mccaw dives from the way drew ran into him he could have made more of an effort to pull out, and with the shoulder on richard brown too many infrigments happen to pick up everyone,

good referring from what i saw from that clip

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Opeta August 02, 2010 8:10 am

Yeah I agree, the ref let em know where they stood. Also pointed out by Rod Kafer, he said he had no problems with the card because the ref was being consistent, and had told them earlier.

I like that they are cleaning things up, and hope they stick to it, this way by the time the world cup rolls round everyone will know what to expect, and there will be no surprises.

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Nick August 02, 2010 8:19 am

The difference seemed to be that when the AB's were warned they backed off and you often saw McCaw managing his teaming about this. Elsom just seemed to get more annoyed with the refs decision and they repeatedly conceded penalties for the same thing. I think Mitchell just ended up being a scapegoat for a team effort.

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Opeta August 02, 2010 8:20 am

"I support the referee totally. For me, if you dont want to play the game in accordance with the laws, then you should not be allowed to continue - Bob Dwyer

http://www.heavensgame.com/bob-dwyer-analysis/wallaby-wipeout-bob-dwyer-analysis

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Anonymous August 02, 2010 9:14 am

First class refereeing!

The main difference being the captaining. Top notch from McCaw as usual. Typical whinging from Elsom.

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edbok August 02, 2010 9:15 am

I think Mitchell was a bit unlucky with the first yellow. The second was a moment of stupidity, and as both teams had been warned, the only thing that would have saved him was a referee who chickened out.

As several people here have already said, it looked to me that Mitchell was sort of pulling out making a hit on McCaw. There's still a collision obviously, but I couldn't see any particular malice, if anything Mitchell trying to avoid a cheap shot.

Franks' was a different situation, but one that often happens with the chunky boys in the front row - when the timing of the hit is not quite spot on, their arms don't wrap around the opponent and it looks a whole lot worse than what it really is.

I can understand a penalty awarded in both instances, no issues with that, but yellows seemed pretty harsh because neither player appeared to be doing something malicious or dangerous. By all means bin people for cynical and dangerous play, but not for the sorts of collisions that come about mainly because of the commitment we expect players to show.

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Anonymous August 02, 2010 10:16 am

Terrible display from the ref and his touch judges.

The game was softer than a soccer match, Mitchell's first yellow was a soft of a yellow card as you'll ever see, to receive a red after that is a complete joke.

Luckily it wouldn't have affected the result either way but it's still a farcial "display" of officiating.

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secondfive August 02, 2010 10:18 am

Just to clarify .. I do agree that Mitchell's first yellow was excessive and in the recent past it would've just been a penalty for late contact. His second yellow was a brain fade that maybe wouldn't have happened if Elsom had made a point to his team about the warning. It's a shame that two pretty soft incidents added up to a sending off.
The "tip tackle that wasn't" and maybe Owens' card (which was borderline, but it's a bad law anyway), some of the yellows in previous games this year, it all adds up to a problem in over-officiating that the game will have to deal with very soon.
I get the impression the touchies are trigger-happy for the slightest half chance to intervene, and the ref's are instructed to just take their word. How can a touch judge be so confident that an illegal tackle has been made right in front of him and yet is not even competent enough to get the player's number? If I was the ref I'd tell him to get his act together, play on.

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Anonymous August 02, 2010 10:20 am

Welcome to modern rugby union, softer than a game of darts.

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jay August 02, 2010 11:13 am

I understand better what happened as they showed the game again yesterday on french TV.
What I'd like to see (please pretty rd) is Rocky swinging at some point...might be vs. an all black lock, but as the game goes on, you see him swinging 3 or 4 times... and that never got called and coming from the captain...
As the ref calling people by their names, nothing unusual... very frequent.

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togadoenlamel August 02, 2010 11:36 am

La 2 amarilla me parece algo excesiva. Sanciona un mero gesto instintivo que no retrasa el juego en absoluto. De todas maneras un arbitraje muy bueno por ambas partes: MItchell acepta el castigo con unas maneras ejemplares. Para ensear en las escuelas de deporte.

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NiWiTa August 02, 2010 11:45 am

As an England supporter I admit I would genuinely have liked Oz to win to keep the tri-nations on more of a knife-edge in terms of the final winner.

I agree to a certain extent with Jono and Cristian. I do think Drew Mitchell's first yellow was a silly/very soft call. The second was deserved and was fairly consistent (rewarded him for petulant child behaviour). The Franks/Mitchell tackles were just about Shoulder charges within the definition of the rules but I really like this type of agression in League and have not seen it present the dangesr that a spear tackle/gouge does. WTF IRB, this is all getting seriously OTT and a good game never got great as a result.

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Anonymous August 02, 2010 11:53 am

As SA coach PDV says, lets bring tutus from now on -> this is becoming more like ballet than rugby!

RD, great compilation, tnx

I cannot fathom why Foxtel footage editor/director did not show the footage of Mitchell's first yellow during the game, esp with the commentators swearing blind there was no offence. Yeah, just shows how biased the editing is :-O

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Anonymous August 02, 2010 11:54 am

wtf!!! this is total crap! of course mitchell wasnt using his arms because he didnt tackle no one. You can see he is following the ball and actually turning around to follow. In the body position he has he cant effect anything on McCaw.
The first yellow is a joke!

The second one is fair enough.

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tecik August 02, 2010 12:35 pm

poor mitchell
and i still wonder why the wallabies always unlucky when facing the all blacks.

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Nudge August 02, 2010 2:25 pm

Whilst the outcome of a red card may seem excessive for what were 2 slightly soft yellow cards I think the referee has to be congratulated on his consistency, clarity, and communication.

He was clearly aware of the fact that it was a big call (which he aknowledged when he said "It's not my responsibility what this decision has on the game") yet was equally aware that having given the earlier warning he had to be seen to be consistent. I'm not sure all referees would have had the bottle to do that.

I agree with Rod Kafer/Graham Henry, who both value consistency and clarity as the key attributes of good refereeing.

Also congratulations to rugbydump for such a well put together clip, showing all the key incidents to put the red card into context.

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olwakachangchang August 02, 2010 2:40 pm

Great vid!

That is definitely a difference between the All Blacks and others, playing to the ref. Richie told the players that the ref was on the warpath about the slowing down of restarts. The All Blacks stopped that immediately and Conrad jumped around like a mad man as soon as Mitchell knocked the ball out of his hand.

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Anonymous August 02, 2010 3:56 pm

As a neutral 1st the standard of rugby looked pretty good over all v impressed by the ABs! But Mitchell's "tackle" should not have been given a yellow. Shocking decision! McCaw milks it beyond belief Drew barely gets a hand on him!! The second yellow (and therefore the red) was at least consistant by joubert, but i think Mitchell has had an exceptionally unlucky day.

As a ref Joubert was impressive but that first yellow unbelievable.

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MAX-TRC-M.15 August 02, 2010 7:54 pm

very nice acting mccaw!
why the nz's prop don't go on the sin bin?
PLIS A LITTLE BIT OF J-U-S-T-I-C-E!!!

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miguel August 02, 2010 9:35 pm

dumb decision by mitchell. there were enough wallabies there to legally prevent(or intercept) the quick thrown in.

he's hard done in his first yellow but thats what happens.

richie does dive but not the way we think of soccer players doing. he was probably going to be knocked down any way but he puts the effort in to throw his arms up and call attention to the incidnet. nothing wrong with that, but at that point he is trying to get the penalty which i don't feel should have been given. especially for the claim of no arms. the ball was passed and mitchell was trying to pull out rathering than committing his arms for a late hit.

also felt franks' yellow was harsh but at least the two were consitent

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DJ August 02, 2010 11:33 pm

1st yellow- ridiculous, 2nd yellow- deserved. ref should've taken the captains aside earlier as most NH refs normally would've from what i've seen. joubert from what i've seen has been hot and cold as a ref, does well some games and makes a shambles of other games. NZ are getting away with alot and are being gifted more too but its not their fault, if they get an advantage they should take it. and why is there less physicality in rugby these days?? big hits are, sorry, WERE legally part of the game but now unless 100% right you're called out for it. disappointing

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Bill August 02, 2010 11:35 pm

What a joke, ten yellow cards in the four games so far in the tri-nations.
Congratulations refs, you've taken the focus away from the rugby AGAIN, and put it on yourselves, and your apparent inability to keep the focus on the players and the game, and not yourselves and your idiotic IRB reffind directives.

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Bill August 02, 2010 11:48 pm

Maybe we should just cut the crap and ban tackling?
Yellow card for anyone who coughs too loudly.
That way, come the World Cup, everyone will know what to expect: Horrible games of rugby ruined by idiot refs.

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Jamie August 03, 2010 1:51 am

lol "rocky, don't yell at me"

There there sweetheart.

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Anonymous August 03, 2010 2:24 am

Richie is just a top notch captain, when franks gets his yellow he's about to talk back to the ref and richie stops him straight away, in the whitelock "dump tackle" it was mcaw who stopped the guy getting tackled from going passed the horizontal, when both captains get warned mcaw goes and tells the ab's "no more" whilst elsom doesn't say a word. The franks penalty was shit, he clearly made an attempt to wrap.

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Tommy August 03, 2010 2:39 am

Eslom was exasperated.
Nothing he said or did would have made a difference, he knew that, and it's why he didn't waste his time.
Joubert doesn't like Aus for some reason, especially against the All Blacks, either that or he's in awe of NZ.
He slaughteresd us in this game, he always slaughters us. The only ref that's harder on Australia is Allan 'Australia is always at fault' Lewis.
The greater problem of way too many yellow cards is a not his fault, but rather the IRBs. I don;t if it's the fact the IRB is based in europe and has the odious example of soccer to follow, or they're just completely detached from the game and don't understand they are kicking rugby in the nuts with their idiocy, but this yellow card obsession has got to be as a result of pressure they are putting on refs.
Can't have player tackling each other after all, no palce in rugby for that! Card everything!

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tommy's mommy August 03, 2010 2:53 am

What a load of crap, Tommy. If anything, Joubert favored OZ in the last half of the game. He called penalties against NZ that he was letting slide in the first half.

But it's not to say he wasn't a good ref - because he was. As the majority of unbiased neutrals have said here, he did a pretty good job of reffing the game.

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Jono August 03, 2010 2:55 am

I think the IRB gets obsessed with various issues from time to time, usually driven by media (and almost always media in the UK, they don't really represent the views of all rugby nations at all, they are definatly more influenced by what happens in the UK than anywhere else, probabyl because they are based in Dublin - which I'm aware isn't in the UK technically, but in terms of media influence it's the same).
So they jump on the card dangerous tackle ban wagon, spurred on by a UK media that is used to seeing soccer games ruined by refs and their card fetish, and doesn't seem to have a problem with it.
The problem is that they forget that some people don't give a shit about their stupid flavour of the month crackdown, and just wants to see a good rugby game, not some ref with a pre-determined agenda, decided by some desk jockey in Dublin.
Newsflash :
I want to see big hits, I love hits like Franks' or Rangers'. I understand that players will soemtime do dangerous tackles, despite their best efforts, and in a game as physical as union, I don't expect them to remove that from the game without killing the game itself. A penalty for most offences is just fine. Cards should be for repeated infringements or DELIBERATE foul play, like eye gouging. Not for accidental bad tackles. This is not soccer, and I don't want it to be.

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Hi Ho August 03, 2010 3:33 am

Well said Jono.

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Anonymous August 03, 2010 6:42 am

Honestly. Just get rid of the fucking wrapping laws.

There's nothing wrong with not using arms. It's not dangerous. If it was League wouldn't have them.

To see players yellow carded for a shoulder charge is piss weak.

I thought we left the amateur era? This is a pro game, adapt to the fucking times. This isn't the 1900s.

The IRB show absolute contempt for rugby fans.

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Anonymous August 03, 2010 8:00 am

"I hope alain rolland was watching.. this is our you ment to ref a rugby match,, no grey area what so ever."

Rolland is one of the best refs around at the moment. Please don't jump on the bandwagon after one rare bad match (which the ABs were going to win anyway).

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Nick August 03, 2010 8:53 am

Just a quick point, I don't think it's a great idea to point out McCaw making a meal out of that tackle after Giteau's effort last month. Even members of the RSC would have been proud of that.

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Benson August 03, 2010 10:25 am

Let's not overlook the fact that NZ had already doubled the Aus score by the time Mitchell was red carded.

Easy to divert attention from the performance and blame the ref. We've seen that already this tri nations.

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Roadpig August 03, 2010 10:55 am

Thanks for the video RD. I think we can all agree that the first yellow to Franks and the first yellow to Mitchell were very harsh, but seemingly consistent with previous decisions in this 3N, and it would appear that they are a result of a recent IRB directive. However, the second yellow was merely action by the referee consistent with his earlier threats of the same for either team spoiling. Apart from these decisions, I was reasonably impressed with the refereeing (I am an AB's fan though), apart from I felt that, after sending off Mitchell, the bulk of the calls, many of which could have gone either way, favored Australia as some sort of penance for the red card.
On an unrelated note, this video confirmed to me the class and dignity of Richie McCaw. I realise he has his haters (IMO because he is incomparable), but I love having a captain like him, someone who has the respect and obedience of his team, an immense knowledge of the laws of rugby, and the class to accept decisions with which he disagrees. The juxtaposition of McCaw and Elsom made the latter, unfortunately, come across as a bit of a petulant whinger. I agree with some of the other comments regarding the fact that it is telling that McCaw instructed the AB's not to spoil, while Elsom merely turns away, looking annoyed. Tommy, I agree he was exasperated, but primarily on account of the domination of the ABs.

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NiWiTa August 03, 2010 11:09 am

stroke of genius Jono - if we can't blame Northern Hemisphere refs then we'll blame their media!

Not sure I agree with you on that one fella. I am getting frustrated by the wrap rule thought so agree with many on this topic that this should be changed.

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edbok August 03, 2010 12:17 pm

@ Roadpig

Good comment. I maybe wouldn't be so harsh on Elsom, you guys were stomping the Aussies so I can understand the frustration.

On McCaw though, most fans I think know he's the best in the business at what he does. He plays right on the margin - he should have gotten 10 minutes last match v the Boks what with 3 final warnings! - but he's always in the thick of the action and making a difference. And he's a class act off the field as well, though I'd say the measure is less this year, rather last - when it was three wins to the Boks, but no excuses from McCaw.

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Anonymous August 03, 2010 3:05 pm

1) Jono is completely right. I fear what happens once the cards continue to get doled out. I for one enjoy seeing players who are aggressive and love the physical side of the game. Part of what makes Ranger a special player is that he's a tough, physical winger who loves to have a go. Same for the Franks boys, guys who love to do what a tighthead prop does best: assert physical dominance. What happens when that part of the game is gone?

2) Agree with all the above on McCaw. The man is simply class, on and off the pitch. Always in the thick of things, absolutely commands respect from players, and always makes the right decisions for his side. Probably the best captain in world rugby, and Elsom was no match for this.

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Pete August 03, 2010 3:41 pm

I dont see what the problem is. Two yellow card offences with enough warning from the ref beforehand! Good ref-ing in my book.

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Jack August 03, 2010 6:58 pm

Good consistency from the ref. He did what he said he would do.

On another issue, I wish folks would stop whining about Rolland, he's generally a great ref and one of the few refs to actually PLAY the game he referees at the highest level.

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Wesley August 03, 2010 9:15 pm

HAHAHA, guys a lot of you appear to be wrong. IRB has just demoted Cobus Wessels the TJ involved in YC'ing Drew Mitchell in the first half for the late tackle.

http://www.irb.com/newsmedia/mediazone/pressrelease/newsid=2039546.html#tri+nations+match+official+change

Bad luck

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Anonymous August 03, 2010 10:42 pm

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information you write it very clean. I'm very lucky to get this information from you.

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Jono August 03, 2010 10:51 pm

Nitwa, the IRB is based in Ireland. It is far more influenced by what goes on in the UK, the media andc the unions in that region, than what goes on in the rest of the rugby world.
It is a long held view in the south that the IRB doesn't really represent us, and basically represents the northern unions.
It is telling that the IRB bows to pressure from UK media frequently.
This whole card thing is as a result of rpessure from pundits, clubs and media in that part of the world as a result of the media beat up about injuries in rugby and the dirty playw hich was highlighted in the UK media during the Lions tour.
It has nothing to do with Aus or NZ, and is not supported by them, but they have to deal with the results.
10 yellow cards in four games. Ten!
It's a fucking joke. Take me back to the 90s when a cards were rare and fights weren't unheard of.
Give us back our nuts.

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Ry August 04, 2010 7:54 am

Vindication!

Paddy O'Brian has stood down Cobus Wessels for the next Bledislow match because of his poor performance in this match.

"If anything, it's lucky to be a penalty," O'Brien said of Mitchells first yellow.

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NiWiTa August 04, 2010 12:05 pm

Hi Jono - point taken although being from the NH originally and living in the UK I guess we'll have to agree to disagree...

Yellow cards aside and also my own dislike of the stilted/old school network that permeates the IRB there is still a lot of leeway allowed in the SH too. For example (might be incorrect here so feel free to let me know), many ELV's are suggested, trialled and converted to law within the Southern Hemisphere first....

Surely that implies some significant input from SH into processes and decision making? I too though would like to see a return to the 90s style of rugby and reffing.....I think many recent stances by the IRB including these stupid yellows and some of the ELVs have had unforseen negative effects...

Later N

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Huh!! the 3rd August 04, 2010 5:32 pm

Didn't comment last week on something Kearns said. It had to do with why NH refs were officiating the 3N, and not an SA ref, as the 3 games to that point were all Irish refs. But it works the other way too. 3 of Ireland's 6N games were by 2 SA and 1 NZ ref.


Whats interesting is that Joubert is considered the best SH ref, and Rollaind the best NH, yet when they ref in opposite comps they are critised for poor judgements, home side reffing etc. But I think rugby needs the outside nationalities so as the rules can't be too different, as happens during the domestic seasons, ie, S14 and HCup.

Some of Joubert's decisions annoyed me, as Rollaind's the previous, but what's special (as mentioned numerous times above), is the complete compliance.

What set Elsom off, was Aus had pen, 1st quick tap was blocked so Joubert gave them 10, then, as Genia goes to tap for that, Kaino blocks him. Joubert clearly didn't see this infringement and this starts Elsom.

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Anonymous August 04, 2010 7:01 pm

Huh the3rd said
"What set Elsom off, was Aus had pen, 1st quick tap was blocked so Joubert gave them 10, then, as Genia goes to tap for that, Kaino blocks him. Joubert clearly didn't see this infringement and this starts Elsom."

Unless the law has changed since I played (about 3 years ago lower club level) Kaino technically didn't do anything wrong because you cannot take a quick penalty and must allow the opposition retreat the 10m if you are awarded an extra 10m for a penalty. So Genia isn't allowed to quick tap anyway and Elsom shouldn't have got upset about it.

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rabbit August 04, 2010 7:47 pm

McCaw should go play football(soccer)! no need for that in rugby!

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Jono August 04, 2010 10:43 pm

niwta, in fact the ELVs were as a result of a meeting had post-2003 world cup, in which a majority of memeber unions (at the time England was one the strongest proponents) agreed the game was going in the wrong direction and needed change to give some advantage back to the attacking side.
The were most strongly supported by SH unions yes, but only after they were formulated and introduced.
The IRB turned on them after pressure from Northern unions who never actually trialled the important rules, the ones that opened up the game.
The northern unions killed them as well, so that's another one for their corner.
Anyway, the IRB represents alot fo the worst of rugby.
The old-school, posh public school boy network of the UK and Ireland.
These idiots shouldn't be allowed to control the game, it's much bigger than them, and they hold it back. But they do control it, and if they have their way (and they're very active in keeping outsiders from being a part of the IRB, or having any kind of controlling stake) they will always maintain control of it.
At the end of the day they are bad for rugby. This yellow card obsession, at the expense of good games of rugby (and the flow on effect of waning popualrity in countries with high expectations of good, fast, entertaining rugby like Australia and New Zealand) is just one example of their intransience.

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NiWiTa August 05, 2010 12:06 pm

Hey Jono - thanks for the wee bit of history on the ELVs, always good to learn stuff.

The IRB old boy network is particularly frustrating when you consider despite growing up playing union in London I had to convert to League (which I admit was great fun) when in Manchester due to a lack of decent Union clubs and subsidy/support focusing particularly on the South of England and Ireland.

Although many would view the English Rugby League as a tin-pot organisation played by "thugs" like me, bizarrely the continued poaching of players in the 1990s (like Jonathan Davies) to earn money elsewhere did force some changes in the game here towards professionalism and more open playing style.

This i think is particularly tragic as the sound commercial management/focus on experimentation with the rules by the ERL (influenced by the NRL) would be a refreshing change compared to the "Oxbridge/Trinity Univeristy Cartel".

I would be interested to know examples of SH/forward thinking candidates that have been stopped from joining the IRB...

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Madflyhalf August 05, 2010 1:26 pm

McCaw is a bitch

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Madflyhalf August 05, 2010 1:28 pm

Genia could play the ball quickly, because there is no rule to prevent this.
The only thing needed is the referee must show the spot of the penalty, then you can play the ball quickly all the times you want.

McCaw is a bitch!

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Fester August 05, 2010 2:47 pm

Here's some news about the judgement: http://www.smh.com.au/rugby-union/union-news/mitchell-sinbinning-wrong-irb-admits-20100804-11a5n.html

South African Cobus Wessels has been stood down as an assistant referee for Saturday's rugby Tri Nations Test between the All Blacks and Australia, officials said today.

IRB referees boss Paddy OBrien admitted that the decision to sin-bin Drew Mitchell for a late tackle on Richie McCaw was incorrect.

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NiWiTa August 06, 2010 12:32 pm

Nice one Fester....Looking forward to mcgaw and mitchell getting a chance to banjo each other in the next one

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Mark August 06, 2010 1:33 pm

Cheers for clearing that up madflyhalf I didn't know that and apparently a lot of refs don't either.

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