Thursday, November 27, 2008

The Welsh response to the All Blacks Haka

The Welsh response to the All Blacks Haka

On Saturday we watched as a great test match took place in Cardiff between hosts Wales and the all conquering All Blacks. It was a tale of two halves as Wales competed manfully in the first, but were no match in the second as New Zealand came out tops 29-9 in the end.

Possibly the most talked about event of the match though didnt take place during game time, but in fact pre-kickoff as Wales stood up to the Haka, presenting a challenge of their own.

All week there had been talk of a response from the Welsh, and while the rumours spread, when it came down to it, the response they gave was simple, yet effective in making their statement of intent known.

What it was, was a fantastic moment in sport as the two minute stand off following the Kapa o Pango had neither side wanting to blink as they stared each other down. Referee Jonathan Kaplan tried in vain to coax the teams into action, but neither were interested in being the first to take a backward step.

Following the match, All Black centre Maa Nonu has warned that in the upcoming game this weekend, the English will be best advised to not try the same stunt.

Nonu was rather put out by the standoff at the Millennium Stadium, saying that it will have hurt viewers back home in New Zealand. He also had his theories as to who was behind the bold move.

"What the Welsh did wound us up. They were probably told by Warren Gatland to stand there and wait until we leave," he said.

"But it was really hard. The Haka is a war dance. If you're going to stand there like that then in the past people would have charged, but it's a rugby match and you can't do that.

"People back home will have been hurt by what they decided to do. Standing in the way like they did is asking for a fight.

"My blood pressure was pretty high but then I regained my composure. I was a bit upset about it.

"If I was facing the haka I'd respect it. The haka is the haka, after that it's game time. If England want to do that they can - but they'll probably get the same response."

New Zealand coach Graham Henry said he hoped Wales' response would not set a precedent.

"The Welsh thought that was the best way to respond, I just wanted to know when the game was going to start.

"It took someone with common sense, the All Blacks captain, to get things going," Henry added.

"We don't need that every week. I hope a copycat situation doesn't occur. It's time to move on and be more sensible."

What is your take on it? We think most neutrals would have loved this moment, seeing it as an acceptance of the challenge, rather than being disrespectful. Perhaps the kiwis out there disagree though? We'd love to hear your feedback.


Time: 3:35

Posted at 10:52 am | 203 comments

Viewing 203 comments

Murffburger November 27, 2008 1:15 pm

Its all mind games. Wales wanted to wind up the crowd and NZ, and did both.A few years ago England stood in Ireland's place before a match in Lansdowne Road, meaning when Ireland took their rightful place the president of Ireland had to walk on the grass. Again its all mind games. Saying Wales aren't allowed to respond to the Haka is like saying none of the other Islands can respond to it with their own war dance. As it said in the commentary 'challenge accepted', and that's all it was. That's my take on the whole thing anyway.

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Neil Hunter November 27, 2008 1:19 pm

I love and fully respect the haka- when I see it live, it sends shivers down the neck. However, Nonu needs to understand the difference between disrespect and a reply. Fronting up is showing respect - it's accepting the challenge and taking it on. What are other countries supposed to do? Bend over?

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Patron November 27, 2008 1:27 pm

By tradition its the correct response to the haka.. i think that people take that for granted.It is a war dance, if you walk away you in theory forfit the game and the "war" but the Welsh showed that they were their to fight and by standing there accepted the challenge what is the big deal. it is a great sporting moment but tradition shows that it is a warning and the Welsh accepted that

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Lucus November 27, 2008 1:34 pm

DISSRESPECT is when SA fans start calling out "springboks" during a moments silence for fallen soldiers.RESPECT is when a team acknowledges the history of the Haka and gives a a respectable reply to the "War Dance"

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Anonymous November 27, 2008 1:38 pm

Are the all blacks ever happy? They always seem to have something to complain about in regards to the haka. In a day where psychological warfare is seen as so key in rugby they expect all international teams to just stand there take the haka and walk away. What Wales did was nothing more to accept a challenge front on and the all blacks threw all their toys out the pram. I do hope this is a one off though even as an England supporter I don't want to see this sort of 'theatre' on saturday.

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Terry McGregor November 22, 2014 3:59 am

silly comment

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safa November 27, 2008 1:43 pm

If you don't want to pick a fight... maybe you shouldnt be doing a "war dance"!!Wales were just accepting the challenge of the haka, so why would anyone feel hurt because of that? Do NZ seriously expect every team they play against to just watch quietly and then run away meekly?! Why can't Wales, or any other team, stand up to the haka and wait for the ABs to turn around first? and Henry can stop whining about it delaying the KO.. it was about 90 seconds!It was an AWESOME response from the Welsh!!!

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Cobine November 27, 2008 1:50 pm

It's the fact that the Welsh have no respect for the Haka, remember in (2005?) when the All Blacks had to do it in the changing room and it came before the singing. Plus the fact that nearly every Welsh person boo's when the All Blacks do the Haka so you can't hear it. When I next go to a Welsh game i'm going to bring a horn and blow it during the anthem to piss the little fuckers off

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pistol November 27, 2008 1:53 pm

well said cobine!

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Anonymous November 27, 2008 1:54 pm

great!I'm italian but I felt the welsh pride in that moment!

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francois November 27, 2008 1:58 pm

few things there:1) AB are great, no question, and they end up kicking wales' arse on the pitch, and that's what should matter to them, no changing room wyning in this game2) Haka is a really cool thing, no question again, but why should it be NZ' exclusivity to show some pride before the game? tradition? so what, scotts should show their bare ass to the oponent "braveheart style"? c'mon, folklore, that's all that is anyway.3) the response was good imo. that shouldn't produce copycat, the coolness was its unique and first-off flavour. responses are cool only if rare anyway4) not even australia would dare? oh come on, rugby league world cup final last sunday, they stood right in front (a bit like ireland a few years back, or france on last IRB world cup), which is a response as good as any! (ok they eventually bit the dust on a final they were promised, and that was cool too... oh wait, NZ played better whe provoked? interesting new argument in favour)5) show must go on. a show, that's what a rugby game should be. entertaining. the tension was great, who else got the chill watching this? no disrespect, i'd say even the opposite.

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Anonymous November 27, 2008 1:59 pm

How thick is Nonu? He said Wales standing their ground "was asking for a fight", after he does a war dance?Pistol, why should other teams to go out of the way and follow a script which allows the opposite team an unfair advantage?No matter what a team does to the Haka some kiwis always complain.Wales stood there and accepted the challenge. What else should they have done?Walk away the kiwis says its disrespectful, fronting is also disrespectful (and not allowed anymore anyway) do anything back at all and its disrespectful. Unless the opposite team does nothing and allows the ABs their unquestionable advantage then some kiwis just bitch like kids who cant get thier own way.If you dont like responses dont do the haka.Sooner or later people are going to get tired of the Haka if this keeps happening and it going to be stopped, increasing calls for it to be stopped now. Im a big fan of it myself, but like lots of people im beginning to get fed up with it, and all the fuss that made if anyone should dare to do anything back.If it goes the kiwis have no one but themselves to blame.

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lUCUS November 27, 2008 2:01 pm

I agree with Cobine that "Booing" the Haka is Disrespectful, i hate it when the crowd boo's when someone does a penalty (however i will point out that from MY experience, its the KIDS that boo the opposing team - lets keep that out of RUGBY and leave it in football!)in my view, walking away when NZ put out a challenge in the form of a "War Dance", is more disrespectful than answering the challenge! If NZ doesnt want teams accepting the Challenge, why do the War Dance?

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robert November 27, 2008 2:08 pm

I've got no problem with Wales' response and I think Nonu's being too precious about it. If he's going to be the spokesman on this sort of thing then he should think more carefully about his words. Personally I think the Haka is over exposed to its own detriment, but a lot of people like it and it has an important place in the tradition of NZ rugby .. but no-one should complain when a team adopts an entirely respectful and effective counter challenge. But it could become a problem if every other team followed Wales' example. There should be an understanding that both teams just go to their positions as soon as the Haka's finished otherwise the whole pre-match ritual is going to get long and messy.

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thedannyclayton November 27, 2008 2:09 pm

Bullshit to anyone who says it is 'disrespectful' it is the highest honour of respect! It means we mean business...It is a challenge back to NZ, shame it only worked for 40 minutes.Why you (NZ) get a national anthem and a Haka I don't know...stop sobbing into your cornflakes, you won didn't you?"Kerivoula"what you said mate, spot on!

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MadDog November 27, 2008 2:10 pm

Fantastic! Awsome! Great!Only to do when the challenge is reak, not every time! And we've seen that match has been a REAL CHALLENGE, for 70 minute (NZ ahead of 10pts) at least.Wonderful, in Italy we loved it!

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Third Centre November 27, 2008 2:12 pm

I am a big fan of the Haka and think it should be performed but is there anything the opposing team can do without the All Blacks complaining about disrespect ?If the team huddle and ignore it (remember many players say they do it for themselves, not the opposition)- thats disrespectful.If they consult the Maori people about how to best approach it (a l the Lions in 2005)- thats disrespectful.If they stand up to it, silently (France in 2007 and countless others throughout the years) - thats disrespectful.Wales were the home team and weren't going to back away on their home patch, fair play to them.By all means the All Blacks should do the Haka and it should not be interfered with but for God's sake they really should stop perceiving everything as a slight against them and understand what it must be like to have to stand there while the opposition gets the chance to work themselves up.

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Flooz November 27, 2008 2:20 pm

i totally agree with Lucus,i think that wales didn't disrespect the haka, they face it and they gave a proud response.But, i think this kind of attitude seems a bit "marketing" and "copycat" as France or Ireland had already done itA pity that they didn't give a response in the game

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Anonymous November 27, 2008 2:41 pm

Poor little Nonu. 'Disrespectful'?.. So you do your poncey little jig and if we do anything other than tremble a bit and shuffle away we've disrespected you?... Seriously? Be thankful you're allowed to waste time sticking your tongue out and slapping your knees at all. Be even more thankful that the oppo bothers to watch. Get a grip. And get on with it.

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Anonymous November 27, 2008 2:45 pm

i think this was great on wales' part. this is the second time they have stood up to the haka and bith times New zealand have left moaning.I terms of the game, Wales were by far the better side in the first half. Then in the second they lapsed into the same old silly mistakes. New Zealand were by no means dominant, despite what the scoreline suggests!But great video - thanks rugbydump!

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Anonymous November 27, 2008 2:56 pm

Nonu is such a fool. The Haka is a unfair advantage to the AB's, they should either only do it at home or not at all. Its a war dance and those hyped up idiots think it gives them a right to be arrogant. Campese had the right idea, just ignore it. This is rugby lads not a war!

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no 9 November 27, 2008 3:00 pm

any team can do whatever they want whilst the haka is happenin.france stood up to it during the world cup and pumped the kiwi'swales stood up to it and inialated them in the first half.anyone who complains about it is probably a kiwi and so deosn't know what its like to start a game when the other team has phycked themselfs up.

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no 9 November 27, 2008 3:00 pm

any team can do whatever they want whilst the haka is happenin.france stood up to it during the world cup and pumped the kiwi'swales stood up to it and inialated them in the first half.anyone who complains about it is probably a kiwi and so deosn't know what its like to start a game when the other team has phycked themselfs up.

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no 10 November 27, 2008 3:01 pm

you dont have to respect th haka damit i dont and i dont see why they get to do itbefore games.

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Simon November 27, 2008 3:09 pm

These quotes from Nonu prove that he is not included in the All Blacks for his intelligence and tactical nous, but rather because he is the a legendary rugby player. As a Kiwi, I was disappointed with Nonu and Henry's comments, and concur with the above that they are being far too precious.From my position, it seems a little rich to insist on the haka being used before every match, and then further demanding that the opposibg team do nothing in response.Either the haka is a traditional fixture (which I believe it is) which ought to be performed before every game, or it is some sort of celebration of cultural tradition, and, if the latter, then throw it away. It would appear Nonu is mixing the two.I was very impressed with Wale's initial response (standing and staring), but less so with their performance in the remaining 80 minutes (this being the substantive issue in my opinion!).Hopefully, England provide us with some competition! (yes, I am saying this just to rile up the Welsh, Scottish and Irish fans).

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Anonymous November 27, 2008 3:35 pm

i think that it was awesome!it built up tension before the match and was entertaining to the fans. i would be going insane if i was having to stand there and watch the haka and be expected to take it like a bitch.... in my own country too!.

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Niall November 27, 2008 3:37 pm

Cobine said...It's the fact that the Welsh have no respect for the Haka, remember in (2005?) when the All Blacks had to do it in the changing room and it came before the singing. NZ did the Haka in the changing room because the welsh weren't allowed to sing their national anthem as a response to the Haka, so refused to allow NZ to do the haka on the pitch. Which is fair enough.At least its not as bad as England who did warm up drills in the deadball area a few years back while NZ did the Haka.

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The Chich November 27, 2008 3:42 pm

What you hacks fail to see is that NONU is precious about it NOT the whole team.Just like the 3 Poms deciding to gangbang in Auckland doesn't make them ALL m@nwhores.Brad Thorn and So'oialo both said it was a good response but they were just waiting for the whistle not a staring competition.So don't take Nonu's precious comments as representative of ALL kiwis or the entire All Blacks team for that matter - it proves how small minded you yourself are that you put everyone in the same basket.How about NZ ditch the haka and the northern teams ditch playing like sh!t all year after year then we can get rid of 2 rugby traditions in one go!peace

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Colin November 27, 2008 3:44 pm

Are we forgetting France's stunt, standing at the fifty meter line as the "All Greys" performed the Haka?Grow up Nonu. Classic, genius response. Well done Gatland!

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Moosty November 27, 2008 3:48 pm

I haven't seen ANYONE questions the Pacific Islands' teams' hakas...Is it because you can actually beat them it makes it OK to let them do their "silly little dances" to their hearts content without any media spin and ranting fans?Thought so.

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billybob November 27, 2008 3:51 pm

why is everyone complaining?it was great to watch and its not like the welsh team were throwing gestures and shouting abuse.. Great viewing

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Peej November 27, 2008 3:56 pm

Adam Jones appears to be looking anywhere but at the All Blacks!It's great that they stood up to it, but it would have been better if they stepped up to the half way line and went toe to toe with them, much as France did in the 1/4 final last year. That was at the Millenium to! The Haka should motivate the challenged as much as the challenger. I mean, how long did they plan on standing there anyway? Until the 80 mins was up? Was that their plan to beat the All Blacks? It's not like it's anything especially significant, unique to Welsh culture. Presumably if you don't think the ABs should do the Haka, you don't think the Fijians should do the cibi, the Samoans the Siva Tau, or the Tongans the Kailao? Is it just because it's the All Blacks that so many people dislike it?

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Peej November 27, 2008 3:57 pm

Oops, just made the same point as Moosty above! Sorry man!

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The tan man November 27, 2008 3:57 pm

@Pistol, how footballish of you..Personally I liked it.There wasnt much to like but i liked it.

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Kato November 27, 2008 4:05 pm

The Haka is a war dance, the Welsh chose a challenge that was just as powerful. They were letting the Kiwi's know that they weren't going to come in and win without a fight. It was great, especially at the Millennium Stadium. I don't see why people are getting bent out of shape about it, perhaps it will be a new sporting tradition for teams to stand up to the Haka, worked for the French in the world cup.

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Third Centre November 27, 2008 4:05 pm

In fairness with the Pacific teams, the opposition stand there, watch it and then play. None of the players from the Pacific teams take offence to this.

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Travis November 27, 2008 4:23 pm

I think it was good and Im an AB's fan. It created more tension and drama which made it more fun to watch. My only problem is next time a team that could possibly beat the Ab's should do it.

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dr November 27, 2008 4:26 pm

Its pretty funny really, I didn't expect that the kiwis would react so negatively. I think its them that should grow up and get on with it. If the All Blacks are allowed to intimidate the opposition then why should there not be a responce of some sort? Maybe the english should do some morris dancing back at them, that'll show them!That said it might set a trend and all nations will dance at each other before the game...and that would just be a joke!

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Cobine November 27, 2008 4:27 pm

To people saying its a 'war dance' watch on youtube the Adidas ad's about the All Blacks 'impossible is nothing' it is a story about how when the All Blacks do the Haka they summon the strength from everyone that has played in the jersey. For the record, Gatland would never tell them to stand against the All Black haka as he has said quite openly he respects the haka and it should never be banned as there has been some media attention to it lately. Gatland is a New Zealander, so why would he ruin his own tradition?

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Brendan "Chainsaw" L November 27, 2008 4:27 pm

I do believe that rugbydump have shown before that the kiwis like to have the last say. i think it was nz maori vs fiji, where the maori did their haka, and the fijians did their war dance (apologies for not knowing the name off the top of my head) in response, and then the maori did the haka again. i know its the maori and not the ABs, but still they always want to have the last say. the whole thing smacks of sour grapes, Graham "Bagpuss" Henry is a fucken grumpy arsehole, and Nonu may be a skilled player, but he's a prick. and as for the welsh fans booing the haka, fuck that too, they boo every bloody team that goes to the millenium stadium, get used to it. i loved the response on sunday, the hairs on my neck stood up, and for nearly the first time ever i wished i was welsh. it was as impressive as the irish response a couple of decades ago, and the french response at the WRC. sorry to add another note, but Ali Williams, what a cnut. Stick your tongue back in. your not even close to being the best second row in the world. chabal and martin corry are better than you, and theyre primarily number 8s. damn i love a rant. especially against the kiwis, who will probs get another grand slam. sigh. oh well, three years and theyll lose the world cup on home soil. now that will be a treat!

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Anonymous November 27, 2008 4:33 pm

Almost every single maori is a christian so its not like its even a part of their culture anymore. If it werent for the haka and maori style tattoos most maori people wouldnt care about there past culture. They would rather thank the christian god that the missionaries introduced to them fairly recently, after ever try they score.

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Anonymous November 27, 2008 4:33 pm

Why is it ok for the kiwis in Munster to perform the haka and not for Wales to stand up to the challenge. I don't really understand the AB position on that. If I remember the signification of the haka is something like "Let's fight and the winner will walk away". I do believe that Welsh were the team that reacted in the best way since France in the 1/4 last year. It's so ridiculus that 2 teams can perform a certain tradition while the others can't. Just absurd.

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kebab November 27, 2008 4:33 pm

awwwww nonu's upset! god they need to get over themselves

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Mao November 27, 2008 4:35 pm

It's a great response but I think too much value is given to it (and to France's response in the WC2007). If you stand there accepting the challenge that blatently, better back it up for 80 (not 40) minutes. In the end all that matters is who wins the match. For those who say that accepting the challenge worked for France during the WC I disagree. NZ ran them ragged the 1st half (13-3) and it was only AB stupidity (McAlister's yellow card and poor decision making, not the referee!)) that prevented them from winning the match. Had nothing to do with Seabass eyeballing Kelleher.If grown-up profesional rugby players get intimidated by some clapping and shouting they should reconsider their job. 120kg of angry meat running at you doesn't get more scarier just because it did a war dance a few minutes earlier. Never seen the Saffas back down in a game because of the haka. The haka dioesn't win the AB games, excellent rugby skills do that for them.

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Anonymous November 27, 2008 4:39 pm

It was so cool but if i were welsh i would only have it done if they're abosolutly sure to win. It would have been so much nicer if they had actually won the game...

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Anonymous November 27, 2008 4:40 pm

pistol, that is rediculous wales are not disgracing the haka they are just opposing it so dont be stupid and im not welsh

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Steve November 27, 2008 4:48 pm

The kiwis get upset if you don't stand there and respect their haka (they got upset recently in te tri nations i think when one of the players went and did some warm up stretches instead of watching the haka) and now they are upset when a team stands there and doesn't move. How is that disrespectful? I'm an Aussie and I love watching the Haka and I loved the Welsh response. Its a war dance. Don't do a war dance if the opposition aren't allowed to repsond to your war dance.

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fLaNKeR November 27, 2008 4:56 pm

Sorry I'm English and I really hope that we do the same thing, it is an acceptance of the challenge which is good, I think that it shows that both teams are up for it. COME ON ENGLAND FOR SATURDAY :)

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Pitseleh November 27, 2008 4:59 pm

Nonu acts like a crybaby. Welsh players didn't scream, didn't run away, in fact they just stood up starring at All Blacks. So where is the problem ? When a guy is doing a war dance, shouting and - sometimes - acting as if he's about to cut your head, there are some reasons to respond.

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Anonymous November 27, 2008 5:05 pm

the kiwi's get a little too upset when another country tries to stand up to their childish war dance. okay we get it the kiwis have had their ware dance since who knows when but today they make it into a joke! do you see some of those faces with their tounges out! the look like absolute monkeys! they are dragging that stupid haka out for far to long because right now they think they are on top of the world. well NZ live it up because everyone in the world knows that they can continue their dominance in all these test matches, but come world cup, NZ won't be in for a placing and once again the world will see they aren't the big bad haka dancing team they think they are.Wales did a great job standing up to this silly dance. i hope some more countries in the world will follow suit as well.

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Anonymous November 27, 2008 5:11 pm

nonu is full of bullshit! the nz challeneged wales, all wales did was accept and stand their ground! nonu is a pussy! played well mind!

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Anonymous November 27, 2008 5:14 pm

i just don't see how it is disrespectful...i thort it was an amazin spectacle that added so much extra to a brilliant game of rugby. It would lose its brilliance however if every team in the world started doing it. I thought Wales played so well first half and was really disapointed with the 2nd half display. The score-line didn't reflect the game at all!!!

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Anonymous November 27, 2008 5:24 pm

I think it was a really good response, and not a bad game too..The New Zealanders shouldn't get wound up if people respond.. what Nonu and Graham Henry said is a bit pathetic in my opinion, regardless of how good a player/coach they are.I was there and to be honest, in my stand the atmosphere was dull; but i still couldn't hear the haka at all.. from about 10 seconds in it was impossible to hear it, i guess the miced it for tv?

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mpc33 November 27, 2008 5:47 pm

I'm French, sorry for my poor english.I'm a fan of the AB's and of the welsh as well...I don't think that what the welsh have done is disrespectful, but i understand why the kiwis feel hurt.Disrespectful behaviours are what the french have done in the last WC (especially Chabal,with his clown mouth), the way Irish fans boo last week-end (and welsh also in this video, silence during the haka, it's also an anthem) and the fact that kiwis munstermen done an haka (when you're an oversea mercenarie, you're not an AB anymore).The only problem here, is the fact that both teams refused to go back when the referee told'em. And that was wrong. After the haka, i understand that we let a moment to the opposite team to accept the challenge (like just stand up for example), but only a moment, like the haka, not minutes like there (ok, that wan't so long).Some kiwis are shocked, just because reaction to the haka are more and more regular. Just during this tour, Irish boo the haka, munstermen done one (they're not AB's or part of a Maori selction ! Damned !), and last, welsh with that. I think they're tired to see everyone doing a special thing when they face NZ.Haka is a tradition, responses are temporary. In europe, we're sending fireworks when our team is entering or after the anthem. NZ does the same, but after the haka.

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Anonymous November 27, 2008 5:49 pm

If the All Blacks present a challenge which is what the Haka is, then they should accept the response they are given back - it is not disrespect, it is a matter of facing up to a traditional challenge in a game with a grand history. It is only fair that the rest of the rugby world can reply to what is a war dance with some guts, who goes into battle thinking they are going to lose it was great and creates moments that define rugby history. The All Blacks are a great team but they do not make the rules of rugby union.

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dean November 27, 2008 5:50 pm

Not Dis respect full. Dont forget warren gatland is from new zealand and iff he thought it was dissrespectfull to the haka he wouldnt have done that. but what i found dissrespectfull was the booing from the crowd when players take a kick Bloody disgusting

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Anarchangel November 27, 2008 6:03 pm

Well said "The Chich".Nonu speaks for Nonu, not NZ.Lets not have copycats; not because it's disrespectful, but because it would be boring if everyone did it.It would be a chance to get another beer before the whistle blows though.

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Anonymous November 27, 2008 6:03 pm

response to pistol:I think you'll find that they didn't disrupt the haka, they just stepped up to it, a bit different and why should other teams respond to it. Look at france in the world cup, brilliant bit of theatre, made for great viewing and the chokers bottled it again. If the all blacks don't want the haka challenged, why do they perform it - it is afterall a challenge in itself. any way they won so whats the big deal?

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Anonymous November 27, 2008 6:25 pm

pistol - at what point did wales disrupt the haka? They just stood there. Good for them. I've seen the Boks do worse. Do you expect everyone to just lie down and submit after the haka? To be quite frank the rest of the world doesn't give a toss about Mauri customs. Its great you guys do it, and a spectacle and everything, but at the end of the day you're flesh and blood like everyone, and no amount of tattoos and war dances makes you deserve any more respect than anyone else.

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Sully November 27, 2008 6:29 pm

After reading these, everyones summed it up real nice except Cobine and Pisto ,who are both bigotted idiots :)Maybe the IRB should get together and decide what is and isnt appropriate as a respose to the haka..And Graham 'It delays the game' Henry,so does the Haka you muppet!

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Kevin November 27, 2008 6:32 pm

i thought that was a cool moment. nonu's comments about how its a "war dance" and in old times "people would have charged after" were a bit strange...should wales have retreated, sobbing with fear? if teams want to have a stare down after the haka, why not? nz get to do the haka as intimidation, why shouldn't their opponents be able to react similarly to this, just because it isn't "tradition"? and if it fires nz up even more, why complain??

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Cornamonian November 27, 2008 6:33 pm

I agree with Sully, I got my calculator ou on dis 1 and the Haka took 77 seconds by my countin,and the Welsh response 78 so Graham Henry shud get stuffed to be honestGloucester 4 the Prem!!

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edmund November 27, 2008 6:39 pm

i think all the AB's are acting ridiculously....Nonu stating that the haka is a war dance (no really?!) and that in the past they 'would have charged'...hmm yes that has so much to do with rugby in the 21st century....lol they have no insight. Warren Gatland being a kiwi understood the significance of the haka and judged the Welsh response fantastically. it was not insulting, as the commentator said it was just the acceptance of the challenge. Something i dont quite understand is when many kiwis claim that the haka is an intrinsic part of their culture - isn't it a maori war dance? - that the white settlers originally 'borrowed' shall we say from the maoris. personally it seems to me like the kiwis are a little confused! (admittedly many of the AB's are maori but think of how many pacific islanders and players of original western european and british origin there are)

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edmund November 27, 2008 6:48 pm

'I haven't seen ANYONE questions the Pacific Islands' teams' hakas...Is it because you can actually beat them it makes it OK to let them do their "silly little dances" to their hearts content without any media spin and ranting fans?Thought so.'that's because it is actually part of their culture and tradition unlike the majority of the AB's who moved to NZ a few hundred years ago or in the case several unamed wingers the past few years...

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Anonymous November 27, 2008 6:53 pm

Come on wales!!! That was a fantastic thing to do they responce!! Wales done nothing wrong all they did was stand there ground and not back down!!Anyway what wales done was nothing!! If anyone watched the rugby league world cup you would hav seen england turn their backs to the haka!! Now that is disrespectful!

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Anonymous November 27, 2008 7:10 pm

pistol, wat r u on about wales didnt even distrupt the haka. they had already finnished the haka then all the welsh did was not move. disrupting the haka would be shouting or something like that which would cause the haka to stop.awsome response by the welsh loved it.

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rugbyplayer18 November 27, 2008 7:13 pm

pistol, wat r u on about wales didnt even distrupt the haka. they had already finnished the haka then all the welsh did was not move. disrupting the haka would be shouting or something like that which would cause the haka to stop.awsome response by the welsh loved it.

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Anonymous November 27, 2008 7:19 pm

Im glad Nonu wasnt in the '89 team when the irish team walked directly in to the haka. And they loved it!Increased my respect for Wales immensely

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Craig November 27, 2008 7:29 pm

NH teams can't afford to be afraid of the NZ, more teams should stand up to them like this

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if i had a quarter f November 27, 2008 7:44 pm

Tradition is a stupid reason to carry-on anything. If you're born into a family where the tradition is incest, that doesn't validate it. The Haka is essentially a silly little dance that delays the start of a game. It has nothing to do with rugby. It's a carry-over from the Maori people of New Zealand that were imperiously subjugated. Half of the people on the All Blacks side that partake in the dance aren't even Maori. A team that is subjected to the Haka should be allowed to respond in any way they see fit. If they want to take off their kits and slap their genitals, all the more power to them. It's all just nonsense theatrics that has nothing to do with rugby. If you want to sing and dance, join a theater troupe. Otherwise, shut-up and kick-off already.

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juan November 27, 2008 7:45 pm

i don't understand this haka thing..why do other teams have to stand there watching some guys shouting nonsense about a war? are we playing a sport or beginning a fight? it think that in the future other teams should do the same thing, and if nz takes that as an offense its their problem cause they are the ones who are saying that will hurt the opponent. if someone told that during the game a punch wolud be the minimum response.sorry 4 the English.argentina in three nations!!

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Anonymous November 27, 2008 8:07 pm

everyoone commenting are so foul mouthed, can't you guys ever have any deciency to talk better language. my son goes on this website everyday for the love of the game and for me to see a bunch of mindless people commenting the way they do is just appauling.

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James November 27, 2008 8:13 pm

Agree with most of the comments, think the All Blacks are being pathetic really, it's not like all our players bent over, gott their arses out, and shouted "you and your haka can bugger off" is it? I dont see how the welsh response is disrespectful in the slightest.

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Anonymous November 27, 2008 8:17 pm

I'm a kiwi and I reckon that's a cool way to respond to the haka. Wouldn't mind other teams doing it, but that was a good point about doing it too long.Stare the haka down long enough so the point gets across and that ought to be a perfect start to the game.

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Art November 27, 2008 8:19 pm

I'm fed up to this "war dance"...all blacks are outraged by welsh reaction??? kiwis say it's a war dance, it's a tradition and they want everybody respect it??? But does this war dance is respected when NZ players do haka in aiport for the world cup in France or for several tv spot???? (and sorry for my english)

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Anonymous November 27, 2008 8:25 pm

"a mute acceptance" no disrespect, or any other s**t. as many have said before dont do it if you dont want a response geez

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Matthew November 27, 2008 8:32 pm

Nonu - titG Henry - MuppetWelsh - Agree with the booing thing, in that it shouldn't happen. The biggest piss-take is when NZ scored a try when 2 welsh players were down. I know they kick the ball out in football but for f**ks sakes, this aint football. Stop booing Wales, your embarassing the nation. However, I don't think the Haka was booed. Us Welsh loves the drink and and the haka and it was mostly drunken excitement with a large majority trying to sing through it or do a 'Wales' chant. The same drunken ambience you would get in an average plub on Saturday night except this time with 72,500 fans.Come on NZ, win with some grace. Heaven knows how much moaning would have happened if they did lose?!

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tehsniper November 27, 2008 8:58 pm

and yet they got crushed

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themull November 27, 2008 8:58 pm

Should have expected nothin less from tehm but moaning and bitching...First they give out to BOD for throwing some bloody grass into the air (lions2005), then they complain when Teams turn their back and huddle, then they moan if it is stand is made ie France world cup and now they are fucking complaing that the were stared at???Get real lads, alright. ye are probably the toughest rugby nation out there so stop bitching like girls and get on with it....Poor lil nonu blood was boiling...yea right. he just scared now in case other teams stop allowing them to get one over on them every time before the match even starts....

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Anonymous November 27, 2008 8:58 pm

its not the first time and its not the last time that something like this will happen to the haka. remember the hallway haka last season? it wasnt a big deal when chabal came face to face with the haka (literally)and stared down kelleher so why is it now? it wasnt a big deal when tonga preformed the sipi tau in RWC 2003. get over it nonu.

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boomshanka November 27, 2008 9:17 pm

Another Kiwi here... and most other Kiwis i've talked to thought it was a great response by Wales ... adding a degree of intensity / drama to the game ... and great to see Kaplan rolling around like a head without a chook .- like someone else said Nonu talks for Nonu, not NZ- thought Tall poppy syndrome only occurred in NZ - some people really don't like the winners ay ?All Blacks by 50

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AfroMaori November 27, 2008 9:31 pm

I loved the Welsh response. My mates and I were all gathered around the TV cheering. It was awesome.

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adrian November 27, 2008 9:34 pm

this is what every other team should do when the all blacks do the haka, gv them the challenge.i think wales did a great job to send a clear messenge to the all blacks ," we are up for it, bring it on"

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Anonymous November 27, 2008 9:34 pm

when the haka is preformed the All Blacks are simply saying that they are gonna fight to the death to so that they can with the battle(game), when the Welsh stood up to it like that they where simply making the same statment but without a haka, there was nothing wrong with what they did at all, and if you think there was then you are some kind of twat and shouldnt even be allowed to have an opinion about a mans game such as rugby. byt the way im am from the USA and i do play rugby

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sebastian November 27, 2008 9:47 pm

well done Wales!them new zealanders in those black shirts are asking for a response, they are provoking it!!!

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Anonymous November 27, 2008 9:50 pm

No disrespect showen by the Welsh, I thought it was one of the better responses to the Haka, (Im a kiwi by the way) i loved it, it was very intenseOnly disrespect to the haka i think is when faggots say stuff like "jump around like nutters".And what Nonu said Is wat most people overseas don't understand about the tradition and what the haka was originally intended for..I think all the Hype was about how long it lasted, i mean 2 minutes, thats a bit over the top if u ask me

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Anonymous November 27, 2008 9:54 pm

Such a powerfull moment, and all they did was Stand up and not moving... I think it was great, not something to do evey match but worthy on special ocasions. As regards what nonu said.... i think the muscles dont let the blood into his brain... how stupid can a person be?Sorry for my awfull spelling

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Fridge November 27, 2008 9:55 pm

Jeez. Nonu should shut it really. Just because he feels like that, doesn't mean all the kiwis do. My mate from NZ who lives with me loved the response, as it just adds to the spectacle of the haka and the game.

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cheech November 27, 2008 9:57 pm

A challenge was accepted. Whats the problem. Any NZ fan who respects tradition should be honoured that Wales felt the need to stand up to them. SH teams are the provebial 'bully boyd' o rugby and I don't mean in a nasty way but in a way where they beat the NH teams pretty much most of the time. This was a statement and nothing more. You NZ fans who are offended, and i know its only a few, should remove your head from your backsides and see the light.

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Anonymous November 27, 2008 10:13 pm

The Welsh done a brillant response to the haka. in all honesty i dont know what nz are crying about nz set the challenge wales stood up to it thats all. defo need more of that!!

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Matty P November 27, 2008 10:27 pm

You know what i find disrespectful Nonu?A man wearing eye-liner.

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noizy November 27, 2008 10:28 pm

haven't heard of a fellow NZer who thought the Welsh response wasn't anything but brilliant.http://dropkicks.co.nz/haka/good_weekend

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Proflyactive November 27, 2008 10:30 pm

Pistol, go home, or just be quiet... Please.The "response" was valid and appropriate, methinks the kiwi's are getting just a little bit too precious about the Haka.Yes, it should be shown respect, and it was. 2005 was beauracracy gone mad, not the fault of the fans, we don't boo the haka, we like it as much as anybody else. So be quiet, sit down, and focus on winning the world cup instead of choking.

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Anonymous November 27, 2008 10:47 pm

Not sure about anyone else but watching Wales stand up to the haka seriously set my expectations high for this game:P got my blood bubbling a treat, couldent wait for kickoff:Pit takes about a minute and a half for the haka? The welsh took around 90 seconds as safa said, so i think that the timing evens itself out. Hell of a responseWelsh and loving it:D!Matt

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Pitseleh November 27, 2008 11:15 pm

Nonu's comment about "in old times people would have charged after" is even more stupid if you remember that in "old times", Kiwis did the haka without trying to intimidate the other team. They danced, that's all.This guy just need a Richard Dourthe to turn his mind in the right way.

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Anonymous November 27, 2008 11:23 pm

the best response to the Haka I have ever seen. (and this coming from a Kiwi!) And they even backed it up with a very good first half. Good stuff

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Anonymous November 27, 2008 11:31 pm

This is going down in history. When you see great international clips and montages in the future you will see the faces just seen there. I think that NZ does enough talking on the field to earn the right to do the haka but rugby is not a sport to back down in so all the power to Wales to show that if you're going to bring a war dance into their home turf its going to be a war with no love lost.

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rugbytoby November 27, 2008 11:44 pm

the kiwis just cant handle people accepting the challenge and teams not letting them bully them. o'driscoll did it on the lions tour and they cowardly took him out. it's good to see a team stand up to these supposed 'indestructables' of rugby.

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Anonymous November 27, 2008 11:55 pm

It was fucking beautifull!!!

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Anonymous November 28, 2008 12:15 am

Wasn't the match held at the millenium stadium? Why the hell should the welsh break up first? NZ were the challengers, the haka doesn't make them bloody royalty.

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Fridge November 28, 2008 12:18 am

And is that a cheeky laugh from Jones at the end, when Kaplan is trying to get them to move. watch closely.

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Ian D November 28, 2008 12:20 am

I'm english, and still the hairs on my neck stood up during that and I felt proud of the welsh.As many people above have already commented, if the All Blacks don't want a team to accept their challenge, don't do the Haka.I just watched the clip again, and it crossed my mind maybe the NZ fans/players are bitter because they ended up turning and walking away first...and because they quite obviously were shaken for the first half.Will be interesting to see if England have a similar response on Saturday.Good job Wales :)

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robert November 28, 2008 12:54 am

Ian D.. "maybe the NZ fans/players are bitter..". I think the vast majority of comments here from NZers and the general feeling among them elsewhere is that Nonu and Henry have got it wrong. NZ fans and players don't seem to be bitter about it at all and took Wales' response in the right spirit. I hope this message gets back to those who need to hear it.

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Anonymous November 28, 2008 1:59 am

First things first. We all know that all the All Blacks are NOT NOT NOT from NZ. Why these select few get to do the haka is behond be, especially those who play for the All Blacks through residency. IF YOU DONT WANT A RESPONSE DO NOT DO IT.

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Anonymous November 28, 2008 2:55 am

rugby is a spectator sport and the crowd loved it. the atmosphere was electric. nonu should stop talking about tests of manhood, and charges, when the dude wheres eye liner, i mean come on.

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Lee November 28, 2008 2:57 am

i think it was an amazing response by the Welsh. they showed that they were not going to be intimidated by the Haka, and if that means standing their ground then so be it.

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Glorz November 28, 2008 3:36 am

Graham Henry moans about the Welsh holding up kickoff. The All Blacks were holding things up just as much as the Welsh were.The All Blacks can't complain. You can't expect to throw down a challenge wherever you go and never get challenged back.

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Anonymous November 28, 2008 3:48 am

Why are we brits calledc the winging poms when all thye kiwis do IS Winge.....AND THATS PRETTY MUCNH IT. SHUT.UP!!!

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ryebye November 28, 2008 3:56 am

i cant belive Nonu. . . where was the disrespect?????so if like the italians you turn your backs its disrespecful. ..if you stand infront of it its disrespecful. . . i say good on wales i think its somthing all home teams should be able to do! (not that its going to make any diffrence to the outcome anyway lol)and pistol . . please. . .why do NZ think they have the god given right to do the haka . . . . i really enjoy watching it.. . but in no way should the HOME TEAM (wales) not be able to stand there ground in acceptance of the challange offered. . . ..

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Don November 28, 2008 5:44 am

I dont think i've ever seen so many comments on RD...LOL

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robert November 28, 2008 6:24 am

Anonymous said... "First things first. We all know that all the All Blacks are NOT NOT NOT from NZ.."Do you know how many players in the Wales or Eng squads of recent times were "not not not" born in those countries? I didn't think so. Your stupid argument has been shot down before on this and other sites. Check out the comments under "Tri Nations and Bledisloe Cup glory for the All Blacks" on RD, especially Felix's posts and educate yourself.

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K Lu November 28, 2008 6:30 am

I think its been said fairly well but I am in total agreement with what Wales did. I love watching the haka and i love what it does as far as excitement, intimidation and the like. But if you're going to do it then why is it that every non-Polynesian country in the world is expected to not react? When a team in a man's game decides to try to intimidate the other team one must expect a response. Simple enough. Keep up the haka . . . but I won't be surprised or upset if teams begin responding more often. Why not a Celtic battle ritual?

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Anonymous November 28, 2008 7:14 am

"Do you know how many players in the Wales or Eng squads of recent times were "not not not" born in those countries?"That has bugger all to do with his argument. He was talking about non-Maoris doing the Haka and calling it 'tradition'.

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Anonymous November 28, 2008 8:46 am

such a retarded response I mean, if a cool team did that it would've looked nice but bunch of Welsh jokers who think theyre making a statement by staring at them and refusing to move like a bunch of kidsThe Tongan response to the haka in 2003 RWC was at least enjoyable and electrifying while Wales just stubbornly stood there and refused to move, very unsportsmanlikeAnd Wales got their ass raped again for like the 50th time in a row The haka is a respected tradition in rugby and when some1 just stares down at it its just disrespect to the MaoriI hate the Welsh

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No.5 November 28, 2008 9:25 am

"why do wales think they have a god given right to disrupt the haka? not even nz biggest rivals australia and south africa do itnext time wales come to nz they should boo their anthem see how they like it then"Im guessing you werent watching the same video, seeing as wales stood there after the haka was over, didnt see any disruption there!"DISSRESPECT is when SA fans start calling out "springboks" during a moments silence for fallen soldiers.RESPECT is when a team acknowledges the history of the Haka and gives a a respectable reply to the "War Dance""WELL SAID!I thought it was great, at the end of the day the AB's get all wound up with the haka, and if thats Wales way of getting wound up then good on them!i think its great!

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robert November 28, 2008 9:47 am

Anonymous said, "He was talking about non-Maoris doing the Haka and calling it 'tradition'." They are all New Zealanders, the Haka is a part of NZ tradition. I disagree with Nonu, but your suggestion that some NZers have no right to participate in a Haka is ridiculous.Anonymous said, "such a retarded response.."Parts of your post are not only disrespectful to the Welsh but let down your own people. Smarten up.

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PATRON November 28, 2008 9:49 am

True they did disrespect the haka in 2005 making NZ do it in the dressing room, that was pathetic..This was response was brilliant especially the ref telling them to move. As another said i wouldnt like to see copycat responses either but response are great as long as they respect the haka. It'll be interesting to see what England would do, since Welsh laid down a marker as did the Kiwi boys of Munster

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Tank November 28, 2008 10:13 am

This is getting ridiculous. There seem to be now 3 variations of the Haka. New Zealand need to reexamine their ideals about the Haka. It's disrespectful to accept the challenge in a perfectly respectful way, which Wales did. Yet the AB's feel that they can use the Haka in commercials, tv spots etc... For the last couple of years New Zealand have dominated the rugby world off the pitch. The amount of sightings that have happened because it happened to a Kiwi is ridiculous: BOD 2005 (nothing happened) as soon as Richie McCaw is spear tackled its a national crisis... New Zealand are a great rugby nation and deserve to be watched by everyone who love rugby but right now they are destroying their image with their constant annoyance at other teams when things don't go their way: the forward pass in the 2007 World Cup semi final. Please just move on and get on with the rugby.

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Anonymous November 28, 2008 10:35 am

Hello, here's Arnaud from France.Sorry because I'm not from New Zealand, but, tell me if I'm wrong, often, haka are replied by another haka into the islands, is that right?This means if you're not an pacific islander you just have the right to watch the haka, listen 20 guys singing they re going to cut your throat and then, after it's finished, just smiling to them? This is ridiculous. There are two options : -No more haka against european teams because it's not european culture-Still making Haka but then accept such response from the opponent.If I was on a rugby field, and someone scream he's going to kill me, I'll jump on him and try to kill him. So welsh reply was not so hard to me : what's wrong with staring at your opponent's?And the AB should stop to think they're the best in the world. This avoid them to think and they should remember last title was in 1987...

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Anonymous November 28, 2008 11:34 am

I have to say, I think Wales made a great response to the challenge laid down by the All Blacks. I think Nonu is being a bit precious over this - surely, as many others have said, the other team must be allowed to respond to such a challenge as they see fit? It wasn't disrespectful, they stood and watched (from a distance as well), all they did was wait until the AB's moved. I don't mind the haka, but I mind when they start thinking that every team should walk away without being able to answer back.

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andy November 28, 2008 11:48 am

So we all agree that there was no disrespect shown at all. In fact i think you'll find that most Kiwis agree with this. It's just the press guys. The AB's (and Aussies)use the press to great effect. I have not met one person who was upset by this incident, i've only read about it.

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Kevin November 28, 2008 12:01 pm

to pistolwhy do NZ hvae a god given right to do the haka? they do it to intimidate the opposition and when anyone does anything to disrupt this act on intimidation they give out. IF the haka is a cultural expression, then by all means express you culture after the game when the oposition will be happy to watch and cheer!

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Anonymous November 28, 2008 12:07 pm

I think it was a great response from the Welsh, but also agree that it should not set a precedent. It was the Welsh way of challenging it and showed a lot more respect than the Irish, who just went into a warm-up routine.I don't think England would or should do anything. It's been done, move on.

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12 November 28, 2008 12:11 pm

why the fuck cant they do this... if nz were so upset then they had a great oportunity to inflict some pain during the match

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Hackney Griffin November 28, 2008 12:14 pm

Zinzan Brooke on the bbc website has highlighted just how ridiculous Nonu's whining is - http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport1/hi/rugby_union/7753622.stmThat's one of the ABs greatest former players, stating what is obvious to all but the most blinkered of Kiwis, that while the haka is a great part of rugby's culture, it is a challenge to the opposition that they can meet however they want. The Welsh response was perfect, and set the tone for a great, confrontational first half. It was a shame they couldn't compete in the 2nd.

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David November 28, 2008 12:22 pm

"Haha the Kiwis get so bloody precious when anybody shows the kahunas to stand up and accept the challenge. As if only the All Blacks are allowed to pysche themselves up pre-match and intimidate the opposition! Graham Henry says it's "wasting time", well don't do the haka then if you're that keen to get on with the match. Just let the rugby do the talking, Lord knows they're good enough!!!"i completely agree

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Anonymous November 28, 2008 12:35 pm

As much as I respect the AB`s and New Zealand rugby, honestly , i think they are not in a position to compplain about a team which hold their ground. Is like they can do a war dance which involves great deal of traditiion and they can not accept that a great team like WAles accepts the chalenge just like the old armies would do, facing the enemy before the battle. Besides, the haka became a common place thing, the crowd need this new things. I make clear I`m not welsh , but argentine.

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B November 28, 2008 1:08 pm

personally i thought it was a good response not disrespectful at all but i agree with graham henry that it shouldnt be copied. if its copied then the game will be more about theatrical performances (like american football) then the game of rugby. standing up to the haka worked for wales in the 1st half but they needed to continue the pressure into the second half. they didnt which is kinda embarrassing after bigging themselves up so much. but that said it shows the ABs that they are not invincible and its a long fall off that pedastal

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Anonymous November 28, 2008 1:53 pm

Pistol shut the fuck up , we respect the anthem as it is ur nation and it is a song....but a war dance should be accepted first time wales has done it hopefully wont be the last...France stood up the the haka and shit all over them in the world cup

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Anonymous November 28, 2008 1:56 pm

not often teams accept the challange of the haka, fair play to wales but they needed to back that up with a performace and the failed to show that again against the tri nations teams

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Cheyanqu November 28, 2008 2:42 pm

From Nonu's comments, he comes off like a schoolyard bully, who doesn't know what to do when others do not accept his Alpha-ness.Maybe he should lose the Kabkuki theatre mascara & hair treatments, and show the Haka as same respect as he is demanding of others.

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Cheyanqu November 28, 2008 2:47 pm

Personally, I find everything a fine line. I think Wales treaded it wisely. Showing respect and acceptance.I do however think that this needs to be an exception, rather than the rule. Folks may say Wales had no shot to win. However, this is as good a year that Welsh rugby has had in quite a while. So I think in that context, many of these players thought it was their "best" shot at beating the ABs, so maybe they wanted a little bit of an inspirational boost.England by contrast is still in one of its crap years. Having them "confront" the Haka this go around would seem to trivialize it.I basically think that I should only see any given player "challenge" the Haka once (Maybe twice) in their career.Any more than that, and it simply seems a contrived reaction. Then again the Haka is a bit contrived.And as for contrived -- two words -- Ali Nonu. Take a look at Hosea Gear and Piri Weepu -- those guys bring it.

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Anonymous November 28, 2008 2:50 pm

Moosty, your an idiot. People arnt complaining about the haka, just the fact that you kiwis, unlike the pacific islands, bitch so much if anyone dare respond to your dance. Get over yourselves

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Anonymous November 28, 2008 3:42 pm

I think the challenge made by the Welsh was great and I would enjoy seeing more of that from other teams(and I'm from NZ!) But what I disliked was that it was a response that could have lasted hours, I mean, couldn't they have done something like a Gaelic chant or dance or something Welsh?P.S The haka isn't really about intimidating the opposite team in rugby. It's about getting your addrenline running. My rugby team did a haka at one of our games and after that we all felt like playing a game of good, hard rugby.

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Anonymous November 28, 2008 3:43 pm

wj warrior....i have to agree, wales good on ya mate! It seems that more & more teams around the rugby globe are devising creative ways to stand up respectively to the haka while psyching themselves up. Why would Henry call this a waste of time?

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Anonymous November 28, 2008 4:24 pm

when italian don't see them they say they don't respect the haka , if a team see them too much they are not happy...all black have to understand other teamdon't care of they little dance.The only advantage of the haka is to do ad for rugby

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Pedro November 28, 2008 4:31 pm

I think it was ok until the ref started calling for the game to begin an the players - the welsh in particular - seemed to just don't give a crap ...So? Now you can just bypass what the ref is saying and do whatever you won't?The show went for a bit too long in my opinion...ps: Nonu is one big crying baby

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nickthehalfback November 28, 2008 4:47 pm

Zinzan Brook has just posted an article on the BBC website saying essentially that a "war dance" can have a legitimate response. These are my sentiments exactly, indedd despite my huge respect for the All Blacks I tire of the double standards that have haunted their game since the O'Driscoll spear tackle in 2005. A war dance by its very nature suggests, nay, demands a response and I look forward to the day when an England team stands toe to toe with them (as they did against Tonga in 2007) and wins. It may not happen tomorrow, but by god I hope it does.

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:D November 28, 2008 4:53 pm

LOL, funny stuff, if they'd kept staring the match would never have started.TEN HOURS LATE:"Come on Dan, we gotta get going"20m away"Jones, move it"

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Anonymous November 28, 2008 5:00 pm

it was brilliant. thats the way all teams should respond

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Anonymous November 28, 2008 5:02 pm

It was brilliant. The all blacks get to intimidate other teams with the haka, why should they have to roll over

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scot November 28, 2008 6:06 pm

if you want to face the haka just do like france in rwc07 in cardiff:stand a meter away from them ,face the haka and then play RUGBY !!!!!!

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Doos November 28, 2008 6:07 pm

i think its pathetic how NZ were bitching about the fact that Wales didnt walk away first... it just shows how arrogant the team has become

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Anonymous November 28, 2008 6:08 pm

No point staring down as if they would pose much of a challenge.I mean with all due respect to Wales, they still got a long way to go before they can really challenge the All Blacks.But the scene was really cool though.

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rugger November 28, 2008 6:12 pm

at the end of the day,it's the result that matters.they still lost even after 'challenging' the All Blacks. I mean seriously,with all due respect to Welsh Rugby, they still got a long way before they could pose a serious challenge to the All Blacks. But I really liked the scene.Cool stuff

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rugger November 28, 2008 6:14 pm

Another thing to add on. I feel that it's kinda exciting when you see another team challenging the haka. It's a fair way for both teams to psyche up actually.

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Selling out, Ka Ora! November 28, 2008 8:19 pm

How come the other New Zealand sportsmen don't do the Haka if it's such a big part of their history? It would be funny to see the All Whites doing it before they're beaten 10-0.Bottom line is it's now more a commercial tool than a tradition hence why its used in all of their big marketing campaigns. You just can't beat selling out, it's a New Zealander's second favourite past time after World Cup choking.

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Anonymous November 28, 2008 10:17 pm

son todos putos y se acabo la historia

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Anonymous November 28, 2008 10:22 pm

aguanten los pumas

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toms andrade e sousa November 28, 2008 11:32 pm

well done wales. great response

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Anonymous November 29, 2008 3:45 am

Selling out, Ka Ora! said... How come the other New Zealand sportsmen don't do the Haka------------------------------------some do mate, go on youtube and you can see NZ teams doing the haka at ice hocky, hocky (on grass), football (Soccer), Basketball

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J.C. November 29, 2008 8:57 am

Everybody walks off together at the same time, that's the respect given to the haka but as soon as the haka is over, to stare at your opposition in silence.... What is the motive then? I believe we accept all challenges but not to disrespect the team and tradition. Some of the AB'S were walking away at one point...

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Selling out, Ka Ora! November 29, 2008 10:26 am

Anonymous said... some do mate, go on youtube and you can see NZ teams doing the haka at ice hocky, hocky (on grass), football (Soccer), Basketball---------------------------------I meant mainstream professional sport, FIFA would never allow it IF NZ ever made it to a World Cup, tradition or no tradition.

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Anonymous November 29, 2008 11:42 am

Who said the All Black's were upset over that response? I think it good! Because it made it that much BETTER when the ALL BLACK'S beat THE SHIT OUT OF THEM! Northern Hemispheree rugby is a JOKE! Full of PUSSY'S!

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rugby fan November 29, 2008 11:44 am

it was one great respond and wasnt a 'disrupt' at allthe fact that the walesh boys stood up to the ABs after the haka means that they were ready for the challenge, great move.

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Anonymous November 29, 2008 11:51 am

great adds drama thats missing from a lot sports these days

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Anonymous November 29, 2008 12:15 pm

"Standing in the way like they did is asking for a fight." So is doing a fucking wardance.

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Anonymous November 29, 2008 12:19 pm

scot said... if you want to face the haka just do like france in rwc07 in cardiff: stand a meter away from them ,face the haka and then play RUGBY !!!!!!______________________________________that is not allowed under the rules im affraid, alot of people wish it wasnt so, but the "spectating team" can only come up to the 40, of coruse france didnt take no notice of this rule as it was the RWC and they were at home

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Anonymous November 29, 2008 12:20 pm

Anonymous said... Who said the All Black's were upset over that response? _______________________________do you read?

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Safferdev November 29, 2008 1:30 pm

I'm a South African, but I love the Haka, and believe it is as important as the National Anthems. I can't see the problem with Wales standing and staring as long as they don't interrupt the ritual. And, let's be honest, they can stare as much as they want if they are going to lose by 20 points every time!

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Anonymous November 29, 2008 3:40 pm

it's disrespectfulit isnt what rugby is aboutits just as bad as booing when a player is about to take a kickjust remember it's rugby NOT football

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No.5 November 29, 2008 4:31 pm

Alright guys, here is the answer to this whole problem, hopefully there won't be too many responses after this one seeing as im about to show you the light and therefore solve all your problems regarding this.........You like the Haka....keep watching and enjoy the challenge. if a team like wales stands up to it the its more incentive to win.You don't like the Haka....Stop bitching go through to the kitchen and grab a snack for the game (if you're at home.) If you are in a bar then get another drink. If you are watching it live then twiddle your thumbs or your balls. Does an extra 5 mins of seeing some guys do their "silly dance" actually ruin the game or your life?!? answer, NO IT DOESN'T!For the record im not a Kiwi, i watch in awe at the Haka, i think its a fantastic tradition, and personally i'd like to see more acceptances or challenges by other teams, not really sure what they could do but hey, be creative!

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Anonymous November 29, 2008 4:58 pm

good on wales! I think every team should stand up to the haka. Its a great crowd pleaser and adds a lot more excitment to the game.

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Antwon [UK] November 29, 2008 8:19 pm

i absolutely loved it!i got goosebums watching it.it was wales just showing thereup for the challenge and werent going to back down from it.Dis-respectful.. my Arse!Nonu Is Just A Big Girl Who doesnt like being stood up to!Well Done Wales!

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cacho November 29, 2008 8:44 pm

i dont think it was disrespectful at all. what was disrespectful was what italy did in the world cup, without fdaciong the haka. that is being coward and very disrespectful. however, welsh players showed thier courage without being disrespectful at all.

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Anonymous November 29, 2008 10:44 pm

Full credit to Mr Gatland, you are one crafty bastard. Watching the welsh team was as fun as watching the all blacks do the haka, which I ALWAYS look forward to. Can't wait until the Wallabies think up a crafty response to the haka. I'm counting on you Robbie...

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Anonymous November 29, 2008 11:45 pm

Can you remind me of how Mr Gatland is crafty? Is it by coaching his WELSH team to lose to the ALL BLACKS? or SOUTH AFRICA? how? WALES are just a bnch of shit players who think they're the cream of the crop yet crumble every time they play SOUTHERN HEMISPHERE TEAMS!Northern Hemisphere rugby sucks! So boring and slow!

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Anonymous November 30, 2008 1:30 am

at the end of the day all that matters is that Wales can't beat the all blacks and neither can any other of you northern jokers. haka or no haka you're still going to be just as jealous of new zealands amazing rugby culture. just because you jokers have got NOTHING like the haka it cuts you deep. keep trying though...you might beet italy or something.

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welshno7 November 30, 2008 11:47 am

yeah us northeners might not beat the ab's but at least we field our own born and bred players instead of nicking them from fiji , samoa etc

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Anonymous November 30, 2008 12:06 pm

"at the end of the day all that matters is that Wales can't beat the all blacks and neither can any other of you northern jokers".uu man your half minded... I like french toast and you.. Dont do the fucking "war dance" if you dont want a response.

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Anonymous November 30, 2008 2:16 pm

All Blacks need to realise people aren't disrespecting them if they don't show fear ! Why should every nation bow down to the haka because New Zealand demand it? Well in Wales - every nation should follow them !

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No.5 November 30, 2008 2:59 pm

To the genius who left the anonymous comment about how no northern hemisphere teams can beat the AB's.......cough, last year, rugby world cup, all blacks lost to....who was it again?! ah yes france....who did all blacks come very close to losing to....ah yes munster...a club rugby team...At the end of the day teams get better and worse and better and worse etc as time goes on, there could be a rush of awesome players then a few years down the line they get injured/retire etc and the team is made up of a rabble. i think there is too much football attitudes being brought in. The AB's did the Haka and the welsh stood there and watched......so what all you "disrespecting" comment people are on about is saying to stand there and watch is disrespectful....playing second row myself you soon learn to unnerve people in lineouts, scrums etc by staring....that probably doesnt make sense to many people but hey it works.ah well, i fucking loved this video, i love the haka, i think its a fantastic sight, but i loved the welsh response, i think it brought so much more to the game!

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il Mager November 30, 2008 3:42 pm

what a great response by wales..nz shouldnt' say a thing about it why should have been wales to leave the field first?you do the haka to scare enemy.. wales didn't get scared so what?nz acted like pussies who do u think u are??PS i'm italian so i'm not for wales or something.. I'm neutral but i play rigby and i think wales did great! just sorry cause they've lost the match..

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Anonymous November 30, 2008 6:53 pm

The Haka is one of Rugby's great showpieces aswell as an act of great significance to all New Zealanders and to disrespect it or belittle it, let alone ban it, would be utterly unacceptable. To respond to it in the way that the Welsh did shows that it is taken seriously. It is an act of defiance in the face of an act of agression. As it should be. Both acts were purely symbolic and performed with respect. Also as it should be. It is the laying down of a challenge after all and a response is to be expected. Not everyone is happy to stand and cower. I offer no appology if this offends you and suggest that if it does your time would be better spent watching football...

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Gericaux November 30, 2008 7:07 pm

The Haka is one of Rugby's great showpieces aswell as an act of great significance to all New Zealanders and to disrespect it or belittle it, let alone ban it, would be utterly unacceptable. To respond to it in the way that the Welsh did shows that it is taken seriously. It is an act of defiance in the face of an act of agression. As it should be. Both acts were purely symbolic and performed with respect. Also as it should be. It is the laying down of a challenge after all and a response is to be expected. Not everyone is happy to stand and cower. I offer no appology if this offends you and suggest that if it does your time would be better spent watching football...

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Anonymous November 30, 2008 7:09 pm

Well done Welsh!That's the way to face a Battle!

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Alex November 30, 2008 10:08 pm

This just goes to show that Nonu is a big baby and he needs to grow up and stop whinging. Tell me how the AB's are allowed to issue a challenge via the Haka but no-one is allowed to respond to it??? Grow up Kiwis. The AB's choose how to issue the challenge so the opposition can choose how to respond to it.

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MarkgDub November 30, 2008 10:22 pm

How do you respond to the Haka? David Campese went off to practice kicking at the far end of the pitch and was torn asunder by the NZ press. Brian O'Driscoll followed instructions and ended up have his shoulder snapped by Tana Umaga. The Welsh stand off drew harsh words here, in the press and from the All Blacks. Either do it, expect a challenge every now and again or don't do it at all. Much like All Blacks pushing the rules, if you do it and get away with it expect remarks.

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patrick December 01, 2008 5:55 am

Maybe the ABs should only be allowed to do the Haka at home... when they are away they only get their anthem.

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Anonymous December 01, 2008 5:57 am

bloody awesome! i support nz in most rugby games but hey you cant fear the black jersey. good no wales for not backing down. all other teams have to take it so its quite right they respond in their own way.

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RecentWelshH8er December 01, 2008 6:40 am

Im not a kiwi, or welshbut that response really pissed me off on the WelshWhats wrong with just letting NZ have their haka and playing the game in a good spirit? The fact that they even gave a response to the haka says that obviously the haka is hurting them and its counter-productive to their game and they're trying to avoid thatNo other team does that gives a response to the haka (except once or twice), but obviously the Welsh team is pouting and bitching that its unfair they have a cool psyche danceAnd to pple who ask why they do the haka in the first place:Can you honestly say you dont enjoy watching the haka and that its a great unique rugby tradition?

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STOP FUCKING WHINING December 01, 2008 10:53 am

All of you offended by the Haka or the welsh response fuck off and watch football......there i said it, i couldnt care less if you dont like it or whether this gets deleted because to be totally honest you are all a bunch of whingey fags. Do people honestly care THAAT much?!?! i mean lets not forget that the Pacific Islanders and Samoa, and Tonga?! (yes, no?!) have a war dance of their own.....or are we just complaining because we really are fed up with the southern hemisphere lions having such a big ego......really lets just shush from now on, because its getting old, NZ have big ego's and they steal players and they have a cheating flanker......NZ have a shit hot team and to be honest are amazing to watch and although their flanker is a cheat he is still a fantastic player.....well he would be to get into the international side wouldnt he!!!

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Anonymous December 01, 2008 7:11 pm

Loved it! The French from the WC last year, and that Irish nutter from a few years back was great, but this? Pure gold.

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Anonymous December 01, 2008 8:21 pm

The reason, it seems to me, that the haka draws so much criticism is that other teams lack an equivalent. Either the other squads should develop an similar ritual and respond, or the Blacks should explain what is, in their culture, an honorable and acceptable way to meet the challenge without offending their history.Tito

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UNHRUGGER December 01, 2008 11:46 pm

For anyone thinking that this was acceptable for Wales to stare down the AB's after the haka, your all a bunch of toss pots and wankers. if any of you truly followed rugby then you might now a thing or two about the haka and this history of it and how it is to be accepted. in Maori customs the challenger is to keep a straight face during the haka and after the haka is done accept the challenge. with Wales standing down the AB's they disrespected the custom and have done something that no one else has seen fit to do in the past. no one else has a problem respecting the haka or the history of it, not sure why the Welsh seem fit to do it, specially with being the lash of the British teams! sore losers in my book and i hope for the history of the sport that no other team or welsh team repeats this offense. and im half welsh for anyone wondering

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Gericaux December 02, 2008 4:33 pm

Oh dear 'unhrugger'. You seem to be under the impression that it is the performers of a Hakka who decide how it is to be accepted. I am no expert on Maori culture but I seriously doubt that it is normal practice for them to stand quietly by and do what they're told by their agressors. Historically, this is not the case for the Welsh either. In short, however special you think you are, you don't get to make all the rules. You just get to make your own. How others respond, is up to them.

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UNHRUGGER December 02, 2008 7:53 pm

Gericaux,do some more reading and until you know how it is to be accepted, keep the post on a minimum mate. the haka is to be respected by keeping your silence and straight face, then accepting the challenge by picking up a fern or feather set on the ground. in rugby we dont have this so the acceptable response is to turn and prepare for the game or "battle". by standing in defiance of the haka, in traditional customs they would charge you and kill you on the spot. which in turn i guess is what happened in the end to the welsh. dont cry because the AB's are once again showing there dominance in the sport.

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Gericaux December 02, 2008 8:49 pm

Unhrugger,Kill you on the spot... pretty sure of themselves I guessOnce again... The NZ boys don't get to decide how people react or respond to the Haka. It isn't up to them, no matter how almighty they presume themselves to be. I am aware of how they would like people to react but you really shouldn't run crying if it doesn't turn out the way youd like. It's a little embarassing for all concerned and does nothing for the image of our sport. When the Munster Kiwis performed their Haka there was no acceptance, the Kwis ignored it and responded with a Haka of their own. Not the done thing, as you well know! Yet, no one complained or claimed offence. Munster got on with their job and did themselves proud. And in the end, that is what it is all about. Pride. Not in how much better you are than someone but in how you conduct yourself on and off the pitch. This is of huge importance to the Celtic teams. The AB's dominance in the sport is accepted, as it has been for many years but it is irrelevant to this topic.

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Anonymous December 03, 2008 3:03 am

Go Nonu! AB's win again.Wales need something to cry and write about for the next year, i guess this will do. Shane Williams, player of the year? ha ha wat a joke.

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Anonymous December 03, 2008 5:00 pm

By performing the Haka the All Blacks start every match with a sycological edge over their opponents. Wales destroyed this edge and in the first half we saw the effect of it. The All Blacks weren't as good as Wales. Pure and simple. That is what people are annoyed about, the fact they could have lost the game and I must say well done to Wales for bringing them down to the real world.

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Abs7 December 04, 2008 5:56 pm

Well done Wales.... Awesome.and the guy bitching about shane williams.. get a grip fella, just acknowledge shane williams got skills...

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martin-offload December 04, 2008 10:28 pm

most comments ever! it is a war dance, a show of agression and intent. the welsh stood up to them and created a fantastic atmosphere and there is nothing wrong with issueing there own challenge. it is a one-off and will never happen again with the same effect. England fans sung Swing low during the Haka in 2002 and ste up a great win. rugby is a theatre of tradition and a challenge much akin to battle. let it slay that way

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Wadey December 04, 2008 11:10 pm

I can't understand the kiwi response to what the welsh did- They set down a challenge to the Welsh, they simply replied...It wasn't disrupting or disrespecting the Haka... If anything, it was a great sign of respect!I think that the kiwi's need to understand that with offering such a challenge as the haka, then they will come accross reactions like this... Isn't that the whole point of the haka? A challenge, and a reply?Kiwi's get a life!!!

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keithxv December 17, 2008 5:05 am

I just had the pleasure of watching this game that my friend had taped, and I have to say...Nonu played like a little twat the whole game.I mean, its one thing to play intense after to save face, but he played like he was having a tantrum.

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Anonymous December 23, 2008 12:37 pm

When will the New Zealanders quit whining about the haka ? if your gunna waste peoples time (its entertaining though) by doing a 'war dance' then dont complain when teams stand up to it. in fact as long as it wasnt repetitive wouldnt regular responses to the haka be far more interesting?

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Anonymous April 22, 2009 3:29 pm

they didnt distrupt the haka wat u on about pistol? your a mug

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Anonymous June 12, 2009 11:43 am

As challenges to the haka go this is probably a very respectful on, unlike the Irish U20's. It should be appreciated that the challenge accepted rather than the Welsh team just discarding it by walking off when it was over.

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Anonymous July 12, 2010 6:08 pm

well.. i do have to agree with nonu though... dont get me wrong... wales n nz r my 2 fav teams in the world.. (no kidding!!) but they had all the time in the world to stare them down during the haka.. which would present more of a challenge.. or do what the springboks did.. move forward during the haka.. that's a challenge.. but to do it after it's done is just bad timing, it looked like they were looking for a fight to b frank..

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Anonymous July 12, 2010 6:08 pm

well.. i do have to agree with nonu though... dont get me wrong... wales n nz r my 2 fav teams in the world.. (no kidding!!) but they had all the time in the world to stare them down during the haka.. which would present more of a challenge.. or do what the springboks did.. move forward during the haka.. that's a challenge.. but to do it after it's done is just bad timing, it looked like they were looking for a fight to b frank..

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Flooz August 17, 2010 12:00 pm

i don't like nonu answer. Each team should have the right to face the haka in the manner they want.

but i would say to welsh, that if they want to act like "300" spartiates soldiers, it's better to win the following battle and they didn't... so that's sorry to say, a bit comic...

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BOPSteamers February 25, 2013 9:36 pm

Challenge accepted?? Wales went onto to losing against AB's like they always have.

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Mo September 08, 2014 12:28 pm

All you do is nod and smile.. That's the best way to say.. "thanks for excepting the challenge". Then get on with the game.

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